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Kansas hiker gets bill: $7400.00 for rescue

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 Author Topic: Kansas hiker gets bill: $7400.00 for rescue
palindromez


Joined: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 191

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 11:57 pm GMT  Quote
 
Mentioned on the news but don't see it yet on their web-site: It's official two agencies involved in the rescue will bill him $5k + $2.4k.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/13485384/detail.html

Had he bought a CORSAR ($3.00) card or had a current Colorado hunting/fishing license, or boat, snowmobile, ATV registration he would have been covered by the Colorado Outdoor Recreation Search and Rescue fund.... Priceless. Should this be on every Colorado mountain page?

http://www.rampart-sar.com/SAR_card.htm
mconnell


Joined: 03 Jul 2001
Posts: 7041

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:05 am GMT  Quote
 
palindromez wrote:
Mentioned on the news but don't see it yet on their web-site: It's official two agencies involved in the rescue will bill him $5k + $2.4k.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/13485384/detail.html

Had he bought a CORSAR ($3.00) card or had a current Colorado hunting/fishing license, or boat, snowmobile, ATV registration he would have been covered by the Colorado Outdoor Recreation Search and Rescue fund.... Priceless. Should this be on every Colorado mountain page?

http://www.rampart-sar.com/SAR_card.htm


CORSAR is a donation to SAR. It is NOT rescue insurance and does not save you from having to pay for a rescue. As far as I know, there are no SARs in CO that will bill you as they are volunteer groups. The local police/sheriff and or the fire department may bill you, but they get no money from CORSAR.
palindromez


Joined: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 191

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:34 am GMT  Quote
 
"........In the event that a card holder is lost or injured in the back country, the county Sheriff can be reimbursed for the costs of a search and rescue mission for that person......."

http://www.coloradosarboard.org/csrb-COSARFund.asp
super12


Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 29

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 2:21 am GMT  Quote
 
I don't like this idea. Accidents will happen no matter what activity you are engaged in. I don't believe taking a hike in the mountains should be singled out from any other activity. Should we have a "golf course rescue card" in case you get hit by lightning in the fairway, "blizzard rescue card" in case you get stranded on the highway and need help, etc... How does one decide what activities warrant a rescue without fees, and which will have fees applied. Very slippery slope. It feels a little too much like extortion to me.
Gareth


Joined: 15 Sep 2003
Posts: 3573

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:59 am GMT  Quote
 
I would have told them to leave me.
mconnell


Joined: 03 Jul 2001
Posts: 7041

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:40 am GMT  Quote
 
palindromez wrote:
"........In the event that a card holder is lost or injured in the back country, the county Sheriff can be reimbursed for the costs of a search and rescue mission for that person......."

http://www.coloradosarboard.org/csrb-COSARFund.asp


Thank you. You made my point. "Sheriff can be reimbursed. The card is not insurance although it seems many people think it is.
Layne Bracy


Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 532

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:53 am GMT  Quote
 
The Golden and West Metro Fire Departments are billing the individual. I'm not aware that fire departments can apply for CORSAR funds, so I don't think the card would have prevented the bill.
palindromez


Joined: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 191

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 5:13 am GMT  Quote
 
mconnell wrote:
The local police/sheriff and or the fire department may bill you, but they get no money from CORSAR.


No one in this thread referred to it as insurance. A simple search would give anyone that was misconceived that conclusion also.

"..............The CORSAR Card Is Not Insurance
The card is not insurance and does not reimburse individuals nor does it pay for medical transport. Medical transport includes helicopter flights or ground ambulance. If aircraft are used as a search vehicle, those costs are reimbursed by the fund. If the aircraft becomes a medical transport due to a medical emergency, the medical portion of the transport is not covered..........."

http://dola.colorado.gov/dlg/fa/sar/sar_purchase.html

"The local police/sheriff and or the fire department may bill you, but they get no money from CORSAR."

You are most welcome - but I think we may speak a different language. ... "they get no money" has an entirely different meaning for me than ..."hey sheriff, CORSAR just reimbursed us for that search and rescue operation"

I heard it was outside of the Fire Departments jurisdiction - not sure if that was West Metro or Golden. Could that be why they are getting the bill along with the fact that when the call was made no one knew where he was located?
CharlesD


Joined: 15 Mar 2004
Posts: 3080

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 1:37 pm GMT  Quote
 
Whether or not it pays your way, it's a $3/year contribution to the SAR organizations. We should all be contributing on principle whether or not we ever need them.
sarah.simon


Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 424

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:09 pm GMT  Quote
 
super12 wrote:
I don't like this idea. Accidents will happen no matter what activity you are engaged in. I don't believe taking a hike in the mountains should be singled out from any other activity. Should we have a "golf course rescue card" in case you get hit by lightning in the fairway, "blizzard rescue card" in case you get stranded on the highway and need help, etc... How does one decide what activities warrant a rescue without fees, and which will have fees applied. Very slippery slope. It feels a little too much like extortion to me.


Interesting to note: By law, hunters, fishin' folk, snowmobilers and ATV users must register and pay for a license in the state of Colorado to partake in their choice of recreation on public land. Granted, compliance with registration laws is not 100%. Still, the closest thing to "registering" to hike I do is sign the trail register at the wilderness boundary in the hope that the Forest Service can identify my corpse when it's discovered next to my dog's carcase on the side of a mountain. Wink Cheers.
surgent


Joined: 20 Aug 2003
Posts: 157

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:31 pm GMT  Quote
 
I read the article and have to ask why he was charged at all. Usually the victim is charged in the event of gross negligence or actual criminal behavior that directly led to the event and resulting rescue. It does not seem to me, according to the story, that he or his group did anything 'wrong' other than get unlucky.

Is there more to this story?
Bob Sihler


Joined: 23 Aug 2004
Posts: 3217

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 5:37 pm GMT  Quote
 
surgent wrote:
I read the article and have to ask why he was charged at all. Usually the victim is charged in the event of gross negligence or actual criminal behavior that directly led to the event and resulting rescue. It does not seem to me, according to the story, that he or his group did anything 'wrong' other than get unlucky.

Is there more to this story?


My thoughts exactly. I'm generally all for sticking people with SAR costs when they were incompetent or negligent, but this doesn't seem to be the case here. Reasonable people can argur whether mountaineers should bear rescue costs since they leave the safety of trails, but it's hard to argue that well-equipped hikers on maintained trails should get hit with their rescue bills. Shocked

One thing's for sure: if I twist or even break my ankle on a Colorado TRAIL, I'm doing all I can to get out under my own power.
Alan Ellis


Joined: 08 Apr 2002
Posts: 2517

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 5:59 pm GMT  Quote
 
Seems that one of the reasons he got a bill was because he is a Kansas resident and does not pay taxes in Colorado. If someone pays local or state taxes which pay for fire depts, sheriffs office, ect., then they shouldn't be getting a bill.
Scott


Joined: 21 Aug 2003
Posts: 6110

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 6:04 pm GMT  Quote
 
Quote:
Thank you. You made my point. "Sheriff can be reimbursed.


It does sound like it is the first priority though? Question

The first priority of the fund is to reimburse local Sheriffs for the costs incurred while conducting a search and rescue for a licensed person. These expenses could include rental, repair and operating costs for motor vehicles, aircraft, snowmobiles, horses and boats, necessary equipment, reimbursement of mileage, meals, and room rentals for un-paid search and rescue personnel, and the cost of helicopters or fixed wing aircraft deployed for a SAR mission.
Roam Around


Joined: 19 Jan 2005
Posts: 355

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 6:59 pm GMT  Quote
 
Last week at a presentation by Rocky Mtn Rescue this subject came up. The RMR guy said (almost exact quote) Our policy is to never charge for a rescue because we don't want an injured party trying to decide whether they can afford a rescue bill. One would think that the group, which is well known and highly recognized would have buy in from the county and state agencies whom they work with.

Now, he obviously wasn't speaking for the sherriff(s), but my impression was (and I agree with the principal) that injured parties would only be charged if they had exhibited carelessness or just a complete state of unpreparedness.
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