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Best GPS for Mountaineering?

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 Author Topic: Best GPS for Mountaineering?
islesrule7


Joined: 10 Sep 2009
Posts: 9

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 9:30 pm GMT  Quote
 
Any suggestions on a good handheld GPS for use Mountaineering? Obviously looking for something lightweight and reliable....

Thanks all!
Day Hiker


Joined: 26 Dec 2003
Posts: 2450

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:06 pm GMT  Quote
 
I like this one, and I have bought more than one:

GPSMAP 60CSx

It's rugged and good for hiking. It has: map capabilities (in addition to built-in basemap), color display, and high-sensitivity receiver (very important!). In addition to calculating the GPS-based elevation, it has a barometric altimeter, which will work even when there is no GPS signal.

It has a micro-SD card slot, and I use a 2GB card in mine, which will hold most of a continent worth of street-data maps. The unit can be set to store track data on the data card, in GPX files. So on long trips, there is no need to worry about running out of track log, if you're like me and like to keep a record of trips.

Beware of Garmin's Colorado (and Oregon) models because, unless Garmin has recently fixed this, they don't accurately keep waypoint lat/lon information. I bought a Colorado a while back, noticed the problem, and contacted Garmin. But they didn't give a shit and said they would address it if it became a problem -- as if keeping the location of your waypoints is not one of the most basic and important functions of a GPS.
Mountainjeff


Joined: 24 Jun 2006
Posts: 25

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:07 am GMT  Quote
 
I have had both the best and the cheapest on the market. They both performed poorly in the mountains. Don't bother with a GPS. get a good altimeter and now how to use it and a compass and map. Make sure you get a high quality mountaineering compass like the Suunto MC-2 http://www.suunto.com/suunto/main/product_long.jsp?CONTENT%3C%3Ecnt_id=10134198673939929&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=9852723697223380&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442490152&bmUID=ijhlV_Z anything without a sight and mirror are not any good for precise navigation

If you do use a gps, get one that is freeze proof or keep it warm. It can permanently damage the screen if it freezes.
Brad Marshall


Joined: 28 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:17 am GMT  Quote
 
Several years ago I purchased a Geko 201 because it was very small and lightweight. It has basic functions that are all I've needed like marking waypoints and giving me the GPS coordinates I'm at if I have to look at the map. For cold weather I use lithium AAA bats, keep it inside my jacket and only turn it on when it's needed.
MtnHermit


Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 231

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:23 am GMT  Quote
 
Day Hiker wrote:
Beware of Garmin's Colorado (and Oregon) models because, unless Garmin has recently fixed this, they don't accurately keep waypoint lat/lon information. I bought a Colorado a while back, noticed the problem, and contacted Garmin. But they didn't give a shit and said they would address it if it became a problem -- as if keeping the location of your waypoints is not one of the most basic and important functions of a GPS.
Could you expand on just what you mean by your comment?

I got a Garmin Colorado last Dec. and I found it to be very accurate, so much so I abandoned paper maps on my half-dozen backpacks this year. I use the 24K Topos from Above the Timber. The screen of the Colorado has 3X the pixels of your 60CSx plus some text sizing features not available on older models.

Here's a photo showing the map screen from a June backpack:

Day Hiker


Joined: 26 Dec 2003
Posts: 2450

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:15 am GMT  Quote
 
MtnHermit wrote:
Day Hiker wrote:
Beware of Garmin's Colorado (and Oregon) models because, unless Garmin has recently fixed this, they don't accurately keep waypoint lat/lon information. I bought a Colorado a while back, noticed the problem, and contacted Garmin. But they didn't give a shit and said they would address it if it became a problem -- as if keeping the location of your waypoints is not one of the most basic and important functions of a GPS.
Could you expand on just what you mean by your comment?


Yes. It is still accurate, like your photo shows. The problem is something different.

Upload a set of waypoints from computer to GPS and then download them back to the computer. Compare the coordinates to the original, and they will be off by a small amount. It IS only a small amount, but it is for EVERY waypont, EVERY time. So, if you're like me, and you manage your waypoints on the computer and upload to the GPS for the region you're going, that small offset is going to give you a significant drift over time, and it's going to be for every waypoint.

Personally, I don't see why any change in lat/lon should be considered acceptable. My two other Garmin units, the GPS-V and 60CSx, keep the coordinates intact, at least down to the 5th decimal place in degrees, which is the precision of the display, and there is no drift over time or with each download. With these units, I have uploaded and downloaded waypoints hundreds of times, and the coordinates remain the same.

To store waypoint lat/lon information is such a basic function for a GPS, and the fact that the Colorado screws this up is an indication of crappy work by Garmin on this unit. Keep in mind that I have no agenda against Garmin as a company, as I am endorsing another one of their products, the 60CSx. Although, it was annoying that their customer service had no interest in checking out an issue that would have been so easily reproduced by them. Just upload, download, and compare.
squishy


Joined: 26 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:23 am GMT  Quote
 
I'll jump on the nade...

Doesn't the picture above, look like it's not pointing at the summit?
twoshuzz


Joined: 20 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:40 am GMT  Quote
 
I'll second the 60CSx. Spendy, but I love mine. I'll also second Brad Marshall's statement about batteries. Lithium, and keep them warm. Also, GPS is not the end all. CYA and carry map and compass with the skills to use them proficiently.
squishy


Joined: 26 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 3:02 am GMT  Quote
 
I want one for driving and hiking, which would that be? I get more lost while driving...
Day Hiker


Joined: 26 Dec 2003
Posts: 2450

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:37 am GMT  Quote
 
twoshuzz wrote:
I'll second the 60CSx. Spendy, but I love mine.


They are about $350 on Amazon.com, which isn't TOO bad. I think they used to list at $450 when they first came out a few years ago.
MarthaP


Joined: 31 May 2008
Posts: 1178

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:39 am GMT  Quote
 
Most reliable system I've found?



PLUS



PLUS



I have yet to go anywhere with anyone relying on a GPS who actually got us to our proper destination. Rolling Eyes
Day Hiker


Joined: 26 Dec 2003
Posts: 2450

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:41 am GMT  Quote
 
squishy wrote:
I want one for driving and hiking, which would that be? I get more lost while driving...


The two I have can both be used for driving, and I do use them for driving, but they are less than ideal for that. The screens are not really a good size for trying to read on the dashboard. I get by with them, but only because I have 20/20 vision.

But I bought all my GPSs primarily for hiking, and they're good for that. Obviously, you're not going to want to carry around a GPS with a 6x8" screen while you're hiking.

As mentioned by MtnHermit, the Colorado has a larger screen than my 60CSx, but I also mentioned one problem I had with it. Another thing I didn't like, in comparison to my other GPSs, is that the Colorado has a wheel that gets bumped around while hiking, if you keep it in the top of your pack like I do. I suppose it would get bumped and moved if you're carrying it outside your pack as well. Maybe there is a way to deactivate that wheel, but I only owned mine long enough to get pissed off and return it to REI, so I don't know.

I bought another 60CSx instead.

To answer your question, even though you are using it for driving, I would still go with something of hand-held size, because you said you need it for hiking as well. So, even though the hand-held GPSs will have smaller displays, it will be a lot better than lugging around a vehicle-intended GPS while hiking. I do use my GPS-V (from 2001) and 60CSx in the car, and each of them works fine for me. But like I said, 20/20 helps.
Day Hiker


Joined: 26 Dec 2003
Posts: 2450

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:05 am GMT  Quote
 
MarthaP wrote:
I have yet to go anywhere with anyone relying on a GPS who actually got us to our proper destination. Rolling Eyes


You need to hike with me then. I've been using GPS extensively since 1997, and I have become very familiar with how to use them. More importantly, I know how much or little to trust them and when to completely ignore them!

They work very well for canyoneering approaches (among other things). If I want, from USGS data (or even Google Earth), I can mark several branched watercourses ahead of time, as well as the target drainage and drop-in point. Up on the surface, with good view of the sky, they work great, and the point marked from the topo data will usually be within 100 feet of our target, easily within view of it. Once we're in a slot canyon, they lose signal until the canyon widens again.

For me, navigation has actually become the GPS' secondary use. I like to use mine to keep a log of all the things I do, just like people keep a written journal or take photos. So I can look back years later and help remember what I did. Or I can look at the data a week later and analyze it for mileage and elevation gain, or I can plot it on one of my topo maps that I make with my program. Here is an example:



Posted here:
http://www.summitpost.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=49228&start=15

This is a very short, simple route, so the track doesn't look like much. I just posted it for another member, with the primary purpose of showing the trailhead location in relation to the tunnel. But I have other tracks and other maps that are much more complex. I just don't have them hosted online and handy now for showing off.

Just like many other inventions, they can be very useful. It's just very important to know their limitations. Never trust your survival to the the proper functioning of one of them. But they are certainly far from useless (in the hands of an intelligent person).
MarthaP


Joined: 31 May 2008
Posts: 1178

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:19 am GMT  Quote
 
Day Hiker wrote:
MarthaP wrote:
I have yet to go anywhere with anyone relying on a GPS who actually got us to our proper destination. Rolling Eyes


You need to hike with me then. I've been using GPS extensively since 1997, and I have become very familiar with how to use them. More importantly, I know how much or little to trust them and when to completely ignore them!


Okay!

But I'm still bringing my topo and compass. Laughing
dan2see


Joined: 28 Dec 2006
Posts: 109

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:46 am GMT  Quote
 
I use a Garmin eTrex Summit. I think it's the best GPS you can carry. It doesn't have built-in map, but that's not very useful anyway. I mean, when was the last time you need help to discover you were on the summit?

Mind you I always use my map and compass as primary route-finders. I need the compass, because half of our mountains are covered with forest.

But this year I used my GPS less and less, and usually I leave it in the car. I feel that the GPS tells you where you were, whereas the compass tells you where you're going.

I have been on intricate routes, where I had to way-point a key rock or bush, to help me find my way back down.

But mostly I don't want it -- mostly I need to be very aware of the terrain, and the GPS doesn't help.
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