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Another Knot Question?

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Another Knot Question?

Postby Guyzo » Sat Oct 18, 2008 4:33 pm

What knot to use when joining cords together so you can rap down a few pitches?

How do you get past the knot? gulp :?

I am Knot a "Big Wally" sort of guy. The few times I have needed to do this, we used double fisherman knots, my partner left the ends long enuf to make two looped steps. When you got to the knot, you stuck your feet in the loops, put on a prussic (we didn't have jumars) to take your weight off your device, undo it, than reclip in below the knot. The loop steps really helped to get your weight off and steady yourself while swinging, rotating around in space.

And something else. What is the best knot to use when you need to tie ropes of two different diameters together, like a 5/6 mil accessory cord and a 9.5 lead line? :?:
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Postby Rob » Sat Oct 18, 2008 5:12 pm

Geez Guyzo, I thought you knew all this stuff, after 35 years of climbing. :lol:

I like the Euro Death Knot. It's quick and easy to tie, and unties easy too.

Image
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Postby Guyzo » Sat Oct 18, 2008 5:38 pm

Rob, hi. I like to keep up. Thanks for the photo of the EKD. I tie another one right on top of the first, but only backward, so it's backed up.

I was joining some spectra slings together the other day and it was pointed out to me that you can not, should not, do that with that stuff. That was news to me. :!: So I have been updating myself, I was even using a Grigri while sport climbing the other day :shock: :shock: :shock: :lol:

What next? GPS? Radios? :wink:
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Re: Another Knot Question?

Postby Steve Larson » Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:47 pm

Guyzo wrote:What knot to use when joining cords together so you can rap down a few pitches?

How do you get past the knot? gulp :?


The footloop method you outlined would obviously work, but it eats up rope, and those long ends with (pre-tied, I assume) footloops could be a snag hazard. A more modern way of doing it would be the following:

1) Rap to with 6-12" of the knot
2) Lock off
3) tie in short below the knot
4) Place a prussik just above the friction device
5) Using a double length sling (unless you used a really long prussik loop), connect the prussik to your belay loop with a munter-mule on a locker
6) Rap a couple more inches until the prussik takes your weight
7) Disconnect the rap device and rig it just below the knot, lock it off
8) Undo the mule stopper knot and use the munter on the sling connected to your prussik to lower until the weight comes back onto the rap device
9) Remove the prussik
10) Undo the short tie-in
11) Unblock your friction device and continue on

If using a friction knot backup, that would get untied and moved to below the knot int he process.


Guyzo wrote:What is the best knot to use when you need to tie ropes of two different diameters together, like a 5/6 mil accessory cord and a 9.5 lead line? :?:


The double fisherman's.

BTW, I'm sure you already know that the triple fisherman's is the standard for connecting spectra cord.
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Re: Another Knot Question?

Postby brenta » Sun Oct 19, 2008 9:43 pm

Guyzo wrote:What is the best knot to use when you need to tie ropes of two different diameters together, like a 5/6 mil accessory cord and a 9.5 lead line?

I use this (click on the images for larger format):

Image Image Image
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Postby riverman » Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:04 am

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Postby MichaelJ » Mon Nov 17, 2008 5:16 pm

[quote="Rob"]Geez Guyzo, I thought you knew all this stuff, after 35 years of climbing. :lol:

I like the Euro Death Knot. It's quick and easy to tie, and unties easy too.

[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a5/Sackstich_Tropfen.jpg/180p


The tail on this one looks way short. If I recall correctly 12-18 inches is recommended for the edk.
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Postby iceisnice » Tue Nov 18, 2008 4:21 am

KISS.....Keep It Simple Stupid! You start doing fancy knots and you'll fuck up one day. You'll be getting off some heinous mtn it horrible conditions with a decreased mental capacity and....woops! The Euro Death knot is simple...and it works. Fishermans is also simple. No need to even consider other knots. That brain space could be better occupied thinking about women....or beer....
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Postby Guyzo » Wed Nov 19, 2008 3:04 pm

Riverman....thanks for the link, good info.

And to Iceisnice...I agree 1000% :wink: I hate it when partners have all sorts of screwy knots....

ME: " what sort of deal is that?"

EX: " it's a Tratters knot, learned it in the navy - it unties like this!"

ME: " lets rap down out of here "

I figure there are only four knots you need to know. Figure Eight, EKD, Clove Hitch and Water Knot.

It is best to keep it really simple. 8)
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Postby Wastral » Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:18 pm

Double Clove Hitch to tie yourself off real quick to belay,
Figure eight to tie in
Prussik knot to get your ass/your partners out of a fire
Water knot to create slings
Overhand doubled up for sketchy repels where you think it will hang
Double Fishermens, never fails
Muntor, for quick belaying on a biner without spending tons of time going through stich plate/figure-8

I have used them all. They all have a place to be used. Its the difference between being able to climb quickly and taking forever at repel/belay stations

Brian


Guyzo wrote:Riverman....thanks for the link, good info.

And to Iceisnice...I agree 1000% :wink: I hate it when partners have all sorts of screwy knots....

ME: " what sort of deal is that?"

EX: " it's a Tratters knot, learned it in the navy - it unties like this!"

ME: " lets rap down out of here "

I figure there are only four knots you need to know. Figure Eight, EKD, Clove Hitch and Water Knot.

It is best to keep it really simple. 8)
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Postby Pyroman9 » Wed Dec 10, 2008 3:47 pm

tie a double fishermans knot.

easy to untie, always works great

http://animatedknots.com/doublefisherma ... dknots.com
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Postby Guyzo » Thu Dec 11, 2008 3:03 pm

DMT...thx, that sounds really simple.

And what is a "double clove hitch" :?:
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Postby jrbouldin » Fri Dec 12, 2008 1:51 am

Guyzo wrote:And what is a "double clove hitch" :?:


Clover with three loops-- throw the second behind the first (i.e. normal clove) and then the third behind the second.
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Postby vincentvega » Sun Dec 14, 2008 7:06 pm

I agree with the guy that said KEEP IT SIMPLE!!

Dont do any fancy knots that are time consuming and that you could get wrong.
Dont use a double or triple fishermans for the above reason,plus its a large knot, so when your pulling your ropes through, their is more of a chance they will get jammed.

A overhand knot with 12-18 inch tails is fine. If your worried back it up with another overhand knot. Simple, and can be tied in thirty seconds or so!!
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