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AT Set-up for Newbie

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Postby 96avs01 » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:29 am

OJ Loenneker wrote:This is by far the best set up known to mankind...


Gotta agree with OJ on this one :twisted:
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Postby The Chief » Tue Oct 13, 2009 2:35 pm

96avs01 wrote:
OJ Loenneker wrote:This is by far the best set up known to mankind...


Gotta agree with OJ on this one :twisted:


So tell me, have either of you two done a complete Trans-Sierra on your SB's?
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Postby 96avs01 » Tue Oct 13, 2009 4:17 pm

The Chief wrote:
96avs01 wrote:
OJ Loenneker wrote:This is by far the best set up known to mankind...


Gotta agree with OJ on this one :twisted:


So tell me, have either of you two done a complete Trans-Sierra on your SB's?


It's on the radar for this season.

Edit: My comment was somewhat 'tongue-in-cheek', as if I didn't have a bad knee I would probably be rocking an AT setup.
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Postby The Chief » Tue Oct 13, 2009 5:10 pm

FortMental wrote:The lightest AT skis you can afford
Silvretta bindings (that will also fit your climbing boots)
A couple of lift tickets so you can quickly learn to downhill in your climbing boots

...just TRY to 3rd class over rocks in modern AT boots!


Watch the Silvretta stuff. Many pin failures in the past five years resulting major binding malfunctions and injuries!!!

From Lou Dawson:
"But breakage reports I hear about bindings other than Pure are usually associated with high mileage bindings or harsh beater falls. In the case of Pure (through this year’s models) the breakage I witness or hear of appears to occur more in normal use.

So here is my take based on what I’ve heard from reliable sources as well as witnessed in person these past few seasons. These recommendations for all Silvretta Pure models up to and including this season’s models (06/07). No doubt there are exceptions to the following, if that includes you our comments are open for your opinion.

) We do not recommend Pure for larger skiers, especially if the binding will be used for resort skiing or aggressive backcountry skiing.

) We do not recommend the Pure for resort skiing, but if you must, we say you’d need to be of average or lighter weight build, ski un-aggressively, and fall infrequently.

) We do not recommend the Pure for aggressive ski touring, such as climbing steep convoluted terrain. Likewise, we do not recommend the Pure for any sort of bushwhacking.

) We recommend the Pure as a choice for moderate touring when price of binding is an issue, and the user is an average weight conservative skier who falls infrequently."





3rd Class in AT Boots?

No problem. I even climb WI3/4 with these...
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Postby ExcitableBoy » Tue Oct 13, 2009 5:56 pm

FortMental wrote:If your attitude is that skis are but transportation, and you're going to spend the weekend, or so, dragging climbing gear and winter stuff, getting deep into the backcountry consider the following:

The lightest AT skis you can afford
Silvretta bindings (that will also fit your climbing boots)
A couple of lift tickets so you can quickly learn to downhill in your climbing boots



I have two setups, a light weight pair of skis with Silveretta 400s that I use with my mountaineering boots. This setup is purely for transportation. I call them fancy snow shoes. Great for getting around the Alaska range.

My other set up is a dedicated AT setup because I like to ski down what I ski up. Skiing with mountaineering boots on anything steep at all sucks.
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skis

Postby Aksel » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:04 pm

I belive that if your main goal with the AT setup is actual skiing,you should go for one of the medium width modern freeride skis(But avoid twintips)like BD verdict,Volkl mantra,Dynastar Pro-rider (Heavy) ,G3 el-hombre etc.Skis like this handles most conditions well and can be trusted when skiing difficult conditions and no-fall terrain.
If your budget is limited you should put priority on your boots.Save by getting used skis.
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Postby kovarpa » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:41 pm

both Vendula and I have Silvretta Pures and they work fine. They are a compromise between weight of Dynafit and beefiness of Fritschi and the price is right if you find them on sale (ours around $200). They also work with mountaineering boots.

I never had a problem on 3rd class in Scarpa Denalis or Lowas - it takes some getting used to though.
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Postby The Chief » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:54 pm

kovarpa wrote:both Vendula and I have Silvretta Pures and they work fine. They also work with mountaineering boots.


So, would you ski them at the Resort on a regular basis?

Oh yeah, and when is the last time any of ya's skinned 5-10 miles with any altitude gain of more than 3K', in Mountaineering Boots?

If you have, I assuredly would not have wanted to be your bloody & raw mangled lower shins.

I encourage you Deb and anyone else out there to NOT Compromise funds for equipment that is the safest and best mechanically efficient.

I also encourage all out there to research the safety record of all eq that you are considering utilizing. Also, purchase eq that will suite the environment that you will be skiing in the most.

Pay now or seriously pay later, with an injury that could have been avoided had you purchased the right & safest gear.

Money should not be reason to compromise ones safety, especially if skiing in the BC.

Take that for what it's worth...
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Postby Deb » Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:43 pm

Coincidentally mentioned - I am curious about the "experts'" opinions on boots that offer skiing and mountaineering compatibility. Although my main focus is on back-country skiing with little to NO walking - hence "newbie." Haven't yet earned such a spectacular set-up that accommodates snow, ice and 3rd Class action.
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Postby The Chief » Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:48 pm

Deb wrote:Coincidentally mentioned - I am curious about the "experts'" opinions on boots that offer skiing and mountaineering compatibility. Although my main focus is on back-country skiing with little to NO walking - hence "newbie." Haven't yet earned such a spectacular set-up that accommodates snow, ice and 3rd Class action.


Are you going to be skinning?

If so, comfort, efficiency and safety should be the primary concerns in both boot and binding.... trust me.
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Postby Alpynisto » Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:02 pm

The Fritschi is about the worst option these days, only Naxo is worse. If you want light and rugged, Dynafit wins hands down (using dynafit boots makes entry easy). If you want good release function and rugged, the Marker Duke wins. If you want a good compromise between light and ease of operation, then the Silvretta Pure and G3 Onyx are superior and plenty durable. If you want to use climbing boots, the Silvretta 500 is the best choice.

Start with the boots and find the best fit, though they should be uncomfortable until you add custom footbeds and the liners are molded. Don't limit yourself with a boot that lacks Dynafit fittings, even if you go with a different binding, since you may want that option next season.

Then pick a mid-fat ski, around 90 to 100 underfoot, with an early rise/gentle rocker tip, little to no camber under foot, and a standard tail. That will handle almost any condition, including hardpack, and won't be too heavy or wide for BC tours. Avoid twin tips (maybe half twin on tail for chutes and trees) and old school skis with camber (harder for skinning). Let the over-testosteroned youth break trail with their 130 underfoot planks. Skinnier skis are for the Euros and rando-racers but just aren't fun in cement.

Then pick the binding, skins, transceiver, shovel, probe, and poles.
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Postby The Chief » Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:11 pm

Alpynisto wrote: If you want good release function and rugged, the Marker Duke wins.


Wins???

I guess you enjoy having to completely release out of the binding, then disengage the base plate from the downhill mode into skinning mode, then have to step back into the the binding?

Yup... this time consuming operation and the 1 & 1/2 times the weight of either the Fritchi or Naxo binding, Wins.

Fritchi Freeride: 2024 grams per pair w/Brakes.

Naxo NX21: 2256 per pair w/Brakes

Marker Duke: 2674 grams per pair w/Brakes

And I'd love to see you ski those "fatties' on the proverbial late Winter/early Sierra Spring Hardpack/ice.

There is a reason why them Rando folks fly with ease in the early Spring Sierra conditions while the rest and their fatties are on their asses sliding, not skiing, down the hill.
Last edited by The Chief on Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Alpynisto » Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:27 pm

In terms of a toe with sophisticated release, yep, way better than your 15-year-old design. The mode change ain't no thing since your changing skins too. And the Baron is close enough in weight that it's insignificant.

The OP would probably be better off with a Dynafit or G3 Onyx anyhow.
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