Welcome to SP!  -
Areas & RangesMountains & RocksRoutesImagesArticlesTrip ReportsGearOtherPeoplePlans & PartnersWhat's NewForum

Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Suggestions and comments about SummitPost's features, policies, and procedures. Post bugs here.
 

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby lcarreau » Sat Sep 01, 2012 2:07 am

But ... what was "left behind" is very MUCH OVERRATED. Kind of like a vote that was never cast onto some that was UNDERRATED, or a vote that was cast onto something that was OVERRATED ...... :shock:

Image
User Avatar
lcarreau

 
Posts: 4046
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:27 pm
Location: Court of the Crimson King, Arizona, United States
Thanked: 850 times in 643 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby Phenom » Sat Sep 01, 2012 5:18 am

.
Last edited by Phenom on Sat Sep 01, 2012 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User Avatar
Phenom

 
Posts: 63
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 4:12 am
Location: Lone Peak, Utah, United States
Thanked: 28 times in 23 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby lcarreau » Sat Sep 01, 2012 1:20 pm

Phenom wrote:I appreciate those really good contributions a lot of folks have put their time into for sure.


Which brings up an excellent point ... HOW do you define a "really" good contribution ? Is it based on quality, content, or both ???

If we are not using our power to vote, how will quality and content rise to the surface ? These are all questions we should be asking ourselves .... :wink:
User Avatar
lcarreau

 
Posts: 4046
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:27 pm
Location: Court of the Crimson King, Arizona, United States
Thanked: 850 times in 643 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby Bob Sihler » Sat Sep 01, 2012 4:11 pm

For me, a good contribution is one that has all the information there so that I can print the page and go, using that page as my sole source of information, other than a good map, if I want to. Also, the author has put some effort into posting and displaying some scenic and/or beta photos that enhance the peak's attractiveness and capture my interest in it. Related, the Overview is well written, telling me why this peak is worthy of a page and worthy of being climbed.

Also, I prefer pages that stick with the format SP provides. I know some people put a lot of work into their pages making tables and borders and such, and those pages look great, but I sometimes wonder if newer members see those kinds of pages and feel intimidated by the amount of effort and time put in. If they get the sense that such pages are the expected standard on SP, they may not want to contribute. I know that has been the case on a couple of occasions, but I have no idea how widespread it is; it may not be widespread at all, but there's no good way to tell. I still vote on those pages, but I don't not vote on others based on their not meeting those standards.

(Note-- I am guilty of making tables sometimes so I can display up to four pictures side-by-side, but I am trying to do that less and don't do all the borders, colors, etc. that make a page look pretty fancy.)

As far as people voting on crap goes, and I know it's been talked about recently in another thread, that's long been a problem here. I could point to two members, both from the same country, though that's probably just a coincidence, who regularly vote 10/10 on empty pages and awful pages. And when I say empty, that's what I mean-- not a page under construction but rather a page with nothing but a title and "Add...here" in all the fields. It used to bewilder me, but I've come to the conclusion that they are seeking friends who will in turn vote on their own submissions.

And just because the owners and moderators never put their feet down on off-topic photos, and there are people who post slews of them, it doesn't mean you have to post them or have to vote on them. Some of the people who complain the loudest about the crap are the same people who post a lot of crap themselves, in the forums or in site content, or who routinely vote 10/10 on it. Maybe we need an Irony 101 course for some members.

Most of us, myself included, are guilty of posting at least some off-topic crap. About five years ago, when the Animal Close-ups album was made, the creator was happy with non-mountain animal shots, so I posted a bunch of shots of birds and alligators from the Everglades. Later, I deleted all of that crap and a lot of other junk (except the osprey picture I sometimes use as a profile shot, since I have seen numerous ones in the mountains and, after all, I use it as a profile shot, where I think off-topic photos are fine), and when I occasionally run across other older crap of mine, I delete that, too. Earlier this summer, I deleted two mountain pages I never should have posted.

As always, you can avoid most of the crap by not sifting through the new pictures and not looking at albums. If you want to encourage members submitting quality and useful photos, peruse the new mountains, routes, areas, canyons, and trip reports and do your voting there. That content is the heart and the purpose of the site.
"Alcohol is like love. The first kiss is magic, the second is intimate, the third is routine. After that you take the girl's clothes off."

--Terry Lennox, The Long Goodbye (Raymond Chandler)
User Avatar
Bob Sihler
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 7296
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 3:20 pm
Location: Herndon, Virginia
Thanked: 1820 times in 1030 posts

The following user would like to thank Bob Sihler for this post
lcarreau, Marcsoltan

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby Alpinist » Wed Sep 05, 2012 8:40 pm

We all know the voting system is whacked. Obviously, the longer you've been here, the more points you should get for your contributions.
User Avatar
Alpinist

 
Posts: 5999
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2003 7:21 pm
Location: Kildeer, Illinois, United States
Thanked: 633 times in 430 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby lcarreau » Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:28 pm

borutek wrote:
lcarreau wrote:HOW do you define a "really" good contribution ? Is it based on quality, content, or both ???

Just do your best :lol:


Borut ..... I ALWAYS do my best, but eventually END UP looking like this guy ....... :D

Image
User Avatar
lcarreau

 
Posts: 4046
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:27 pm
Location: Court of the Crimson King, Arizona, United States
Thanked: 850 times in 643 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby MoapaPk » Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:35 pm

lcarreau wrote:
Phenom wrote:I appreciate those really good contributions a lot of folks have put their time into for sure.


Which brings up an excellent point ... HOW do you define a "really" good contribution ? Is it based on quality, content, or both ???


It's the quality of the content.

For mountain/rock/route pages:
Was it useful? Did it really help you to finish the mountain/route, or did it remove an ambiguity you found in other guides/maps?

I was just checking some routes on summitpost, for an upcoming trip. The descriptions were vague, and the geographic directions were totally incorrect (e.g. said "north" when the author meant "west"). That is not useful information; but the author did have pretty pictures. I ended up using a TR from Peakbagger.com (the TR was verified 2x by other climbers). I have nothing against people giving limited information, so as not to spoil the fun of route-finding; but the given information should at least be correct.

I will rate a words-only description, which is accurate, over an incorrect description full of pretty pictures.
User Avatar
MoapaPk

 
Posts: 7610
Joined: Fri May 13, 2005 7:42 pm
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada, United States
Thanked: 739 times in 477 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby Bob Sihler » Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:45 pm

MoapaPk wrote:I was just checking some routes on summitpost, for an upcoming trip. The descriptions were vague, and the geographic directions were totally incorrect (e.g. said "north" when the author meant "west"). That is not useful information; but the author did have pretty pictures. I ended up using a TR from Peakbagger.com (the TR was verified 2x by other climbers). I have nothing against people giving limited information, so as not to spoil the fun of route-finding; but the given information should at least be correct.


If you find bad information and the page owner is inactive, you can ask the elves to correct the information. If the page owner is active, obviously it would be better to contact that person first.

And should anyone find an error in one of my pages, I hope to be alerted so as to correct a mistake.

Some mistakes are honest ones. Recently, I found that I had written to turn one direction when I knew (and meant to write) to turn the other way. Fortunately, I saw and corrected it quickly, but people don't always catch those things even when they self-edit.
"Alcohol is like love. The first kiss is magic, the second is intimate, the third is routine. After that you take the girl's clothes off."

--Terry Lennox, The Long Goodbye (Raymond Chandler)
User Avatar
Bob Sihler
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 7296
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 3:20 pm
Location: Herndon, Virginia
Thanked: 1820 times in 1030 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby Josh Lewis » Wed Sep 05, 2012 11:06 pm

I had the same issue Bob did with my Glacier Peak page. Thankfully someone corrected me in an email which I then had to inspect my pages for this one turn into the city of Arlington. Now my pages should be pretty much error free. 8)
My Websites: Alpine Josh · Alpine Ascent · AceMaps
User Avatar
Josh Lewis

 
Posts: 2275
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:12 pm
Location: Lynnwood, Washington, The Cloudiest Place on Earth, United States
Thanked: 472 times in 323 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby MoapaPk » Wed Sep 05, 2012 11:28 pm

I have made mistakes and corrected them when I was notified; it's easy to make mistakes when trying to provide detail. In part, that's why I add gps waypoints; I can pull them from a track without any chance for human degradation of the correct values.

When I get an actual track for the routes where I (recently) found the mistake, I will post the map on that route, along with a polite note of correction. And I will try to delete this dialogue.
User Avatar
MoapaPk

 
Posts: 7610
Joined: Fri May 13, 2005 7:42 pm
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada, United States
Thanked: 739 times in 477 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby mrchad9 » Thu Sep 06, 2012 12:19 am

Someone... let's call them PoapaMk for the time being to keep it anonymous... PM'd me to correct one of my pages a few months ago. I had said east, instead of west, by mistake in the driving directions. Poor editing on my part. But the page did have lots of pretty pictures.

Sorry PoapaMk!
User Avatar
mrchad9

 
Posts: 4176
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:01 am
Location: San Ramon, California, United States
Thanked: 1202 times in 814 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby Josh Lewis » Thu Sep 06, 2012 12:30 am

Eye candy is very important in my book. 8) :D
If a good mountain does not have any eye candy, even if the text is good, I usually refuse to vote on it.
My Websites: Alpine Josh · Alpine Ascent · AceMaps
User Avatar
Josh Lewis

 
Posts: 2275
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:12 pm
Location: Lynnwood, Washington, The Cloudiest Place on Earth, United States
Thanked: 472 times in 323 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby MoapaPk » Thu Sep 06, 2012 1:19 am

mrchad9 wrote:Someone... let's call them PoapaMk for the time being to keep it anonymous... PM'd me to correct one of my pages a few months ago. I had said east, instead of west, by mistake in the driving directions. Poor editing on my part. But the page did have lots of pretty pictures.

Sorry PoapaMk!


PoapaMk PM'd me and said your page was great -- the error was obvious, because it was inconsistent with the rest of the directions. The detail for the rest was spot on, making the error obvious. That is, according to PoapaMk.

The problem I have, is when the directions are so brief and vague, that it isn't really easy to tell if "west" or "north" is correct, and there are no maps or route photos. So you look at the topo maps, figure out where the person really wanted to go, then find 2 other reports for trips that started at the same place, but went "west." It's a neat exercise in forensics, but not a really good use of time.

One doesn't need to have GPS-type waypoints; just a reference to a map (even the USGS quad name will do), some bearings, and descriptions like "cut north of the point labeled 2050m..." are plenty good enough.
User Avatar
MoapaPk

 
Posts: 7610
Joined: Fri May 13, 2005 7:42 pm
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada, United States
Thanked: 739 times in 477 posts

Re: Beating a dead horse on voting again ?

Postby lcarreau » Thu Sep 06, 2012 1:41 am

Josh Lewis wrote:Eye candy is very important in my book. 8) :D


Which book are you reading there, Josh ?


MoapaPk wrote:It's the quality of the content.



I would think there should be some middle ground. Nobody's perfect, so people are going to make some mistakes. I'm casting my vote for "middle ground."

User Avatar
lcarreau

 
Posts: 4046
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:27 pm
Location: Court of the Crimson King, Arizona, United States
Thanked: 850 times in 643 posts

PreviousNext

Return to Site Feedback

 


  • Related topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

© 2006-2013 SummitPost.org. All Rights Reserved.