So I had an experience the other day and I am just curious to see how other SP members would have responded.

I was at a local crag that I frequent about once a week. This crag is right near a highway and road noise is a problem with communicating with the top of the crag. Hence it has become the practice to leave some gear, a pack or whatever, at the base of the climb you are going to drop a rope on (this is mainly a TR crag). I get there (no one else is at the crag yet) set up my anchor yell rope! even though I know no one can hear me and then drop my rope. Well once I get down there are two guys (never seen them before and they are clearly new to the crag) are at the bottom of the climb and start giving me attitude for dropping a rope on them. I explain to them that you cannot hear what is going on up top and that it is crag etiquette to leave something at the bottom of the route you are setting up. They basically tell me to go $%^ myself. I decided to let it go and walked away.

Do you think I:

A. Handled the situation right
B. Was wrong to begin with
C. Should have given them a piece of my mind/punched the guy in the face
D. Other

A. Handled the situation right

I agree. Any time you can avoid confrontation, you've made the right choice. Good for you.

You certainly were not in the wrong. And yes, usually best to ignore folks in those situations, never now what could happen otherwise. Break even and move on with the rest of an enjoyable day.

You should have knocked some rocks down first. Then they would have been aware that someone was above, and would have gotten out of the way.

MikeTX wrote:what's local etiquette for when you launch a rock? how do you protect your belay if he can't hear you?

Pretty much the same as if you are in the mountains and cannot hear your leader. Wear a helmet and keep a sharp eye out.

Sounds like you did nothing wrong. Expect indecency, lack of courtesy, & ruffled feathers in places where egos & ignorance collide, which happens frequently at toprope or 'easier' crags, where gym hardmen show up & don't have an understanding of how things work outside.

I was enjoying a moderate multi-pitch classic a year or 2 ago at Lover's Leap. After waiting a bit to start, as not to be right on the next party's ass, we got going. They were taking way longer than expected, & I asked the dude belaying his partner if I could join him at the large, sloping belay ledge he was at above me. Despite his protests & insistance that there was no room, I came up- there was no good place for me before where I was, there was plenty of room despite his protests (I'd been on the climb numerous times before), & I knew there would be plenty of good placements for an anchor. He voiced his dissatisfaction with my decision upon my arrival, & said something about him being a "local." I told him that in all likelihood I'd climbed there more frequently than he, he should get over it, set up my own anchor, & ignored him from then on out. He had plenty of room, I had plenty of room, & there was really no reason for him to get bent out of shape. Some people's opinions aren't worth listening to, or getting upset about.

We climb at a crag that is heavily used and all top ropes. When we lower a rope we never just toss it. Instead we lower both ends slowly until the whole rope has been lowered. This obviously doesn't work if the crag is less than vert but then usually tr only locations are all overhanging.

MoapaPk wrote:You should have knocked some rocks down first. Then they would have been aware that someone was above, and would have gotten out of the way.

Joking, of course.

MikeTX wrote:

Ice9 wrote:

MikeTX wrote:what's local etiquette for when you launch a rock? how do you protect your belay if he can't hear you?

Pretty much the same as if you are in the mountains and cannot hear your leader. Wear a helmet and keep a sharp eye out.

well, i think you handled the situation fine. but i also would've not been happy to have a rope come zipping down on top of me with no warning. i wouldn't have reacted the same as your "friend" - not my stlye. but safety and consideration for others at the crag are always a nice thing. of course, if you have a "locals only" attitude, that probably doesn't matter.

Definitely not a locals only attitude, but you cannot hear anyone from the top of the crag. Thus we have adopted a system that lets us know. I was the only one there when I arrived and you cannot see the bottom of this climb from the top.

Also snaking the rope down is not an option as it would get stuck. My attitude, as learned from the older climbers when I was learning to climb is always be aware at the bottom of any cliff and expect something to come down.

D. Other (lowered the ropes and rapped down them if they tangled up) - you can't expect everybody at your crag being local and familiar with the etiquette...

edited to add: rappel only if ropes get stuck

Definitely not a locals only attitude, but you cannot hear anyone from the top of the crag.

This crag must be located directly over a 12 lane freeway?

I mean the maximum height is 200', and that is if you are top roping with 2 60M ropes. A loud shout over the edge of "ROPE!!" cannot be heard at the base?

The reason you guys can't hear is that you've all gone deaf climbing in that much noise. You can get a cheap sound pressure level meter at radio shack.


If it indicates an ambient noise level of more than 86 dB get ear protection.

Good point, Kris!

Also, the correct etiquette for throwing ropes is to yell "Rope" twice, wait a moment and only then throw the ropes. Too often people yell "Rope" as they throw it - annoys heck out of me...

ksolem wrote:

Definitely not a locals only attitude, but you cannot hear anyone from the top of the crag.

This crag must be located directly over a 12 lane freeway?

I mean the maximum height is 200', and that is if you are top roping with 2 60M ropes. A loud shout over the edge of "ROPE!!" cannot be heard at the base?

The reason you guys can't hear is that you've all gone deaf climbing in that much noise. You can get a cheap sound pressure level meter at radio shack.


If it indicates an ambient noise level of more than 86 dB get ear protection.

It is about 300 feet from a two lane route on which cars drive about 60mph. Cliff height is about 80 feet. It is through a pass and the acoustics serve to amplify the sound of the cars, believe me you cannot hear people on the bottom from the top.

Also in regards to rappeling, I had never thought about that but I normally do not rappel at TR crags. Rappeling is dangerous when not necessary and many very experienced climbers and mountaineers have been hurt this way, many at the local crag where your guard is down.

Also I welcome anyone to my local crags but I think you have to respect the locals and the local etiquette. I calmly told these two what the procedure was at this crag and they got very hostile with me.

ok, I just went back and edited my response. I meant to say, I'd rappel only if the ropes get tangled or stuck during the lower off. What is so dangerous about the single pitch rappel? The anchor? Then you shouldn't be top roping off it, if you are nervous about the rappel itself, use autoblock and let your partner give you a fireman's belay. Most rappelling accidents occur from crappy anchors or rapping off the ends of the ropes, if you are setting up a top rope your anchor should be bomber and both of your rope ends should be on the ground. But you are right, I wouldn't advocate any unnecessary rappels - only do it if your rope gets stuck. In that case you SHOULD BE USING THE AUTOBLOCK or some other way to backup your rappel.