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How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby Bruno » Mon Nov 01, 2010 4:44 pm

Fletch wrote:Unfortunately, European languages are dying (birthrates <2.1 means there are less and less people who speak French, German, Italian, etc everyday). In 100 years the whole world will speak English, Chinese, Arabic, and Spanish... It's unfortunate, but it's the truth...

Actually I always thought that English and Spanish were orgininally (and still are) European languages... :wink:
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby visentin » Tue Nov 02, 2010 8:07 am

Fletch wrote:
Petro wrote:
Fletch wrote:Visentin (you seem nice), but man up. If you want to name things in foreign languages then find one of those translate buttons...

I guess you don't speak any foreign languages. Just English, right? And you probably think that it's everyone's duty to speak English and forget their gay mother-tongues.
Man up, nobody's interested in your opinion.


Of course they're interested in my opinions!


Fletch, the basic problem is that you mix the topic of what language SP uses, and the topic of spelling.

Bruno_Tibet wrote:As Borut suggested, it might be nice to keep the š, ž, č ... in the text, but this is not a necessity as these special signs (like the French accents) do not exist in English. Under query name, it is necessary to also include the spelling without accents, so that English speakers can find the mountain.

They do. You just copy/paste from Google and that does the trick. As for the query field, you summarized it very well.
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby yatsek » Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:08 am

1.1 What language should I use for my submissions?

We prefer all submissions to be in English, including reports, logs, comments, and photo captions.

Excellent spelling and grammar are strongly encouraged.
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby visentin » Tue Nov 02, 2010 9:26 am

It is not here about SP language (why asking ? It's in the FAQ) but about (excellent) spelling.

One part of my original question should be as follows: when should we "translate in English" places names and when not.
The question might sound absurd, but in some languages (slavic between others) we declinate surnames (then place names), something unimaginable in other languages where surnames are sacred and unmodifiable (tennis player Caroline Wozniacki, not Wozniacka, is an example).
Which perhaps explains the tendancy some countries to systematically translate all places names that can be translated. Making unclear the barrier between what one would call "etymology of a place name" and "excellent English".
One example: should Hajducka vrata be Rebel's door ?
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby Nanuls » Tue Nov 02, 2010 10:49 am

This whole thread seems to be a whole lot of fuss about nothing. The precedent was set years ago.

It’s quite simple, if a mountain has commonly used native and English (or whatever) names, call the page both, for example:

Mount McKinley (Denali)

or

Matterhorn - Monte Cervino

or

Snowdon/Yr Wyddfa


If it doesn’t, just give it its native name and use all the special characters you want.

...also don't just translate the name into English for no other reason than this is an English language site. If it's not known by an English name, then there's no need to give it one.

…and use your own initiative as to what’s a commonly used name, nobody wants to see titles turn into paragraphs.

Simple.
dim brys, dim chwys
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby visentin » Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:12 am

Nanuls wrote:Simple.


Nanuls, to make a better example, what would you say if for example a page about Buachaille Etive Mòr was titled "Great herdsman of Etive" ?
Sure that's correct English, but what about the ethic of places names I am trying to raise here ?
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby yatsek » Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:25 am

borutb wrote:
yatsek wrote:1.1 What language should I use for my submissions?

We prefer all submissions to be in English, including reports, logs, comments, and photo captions.

Excellent spelling and grammar are strongly encouraged.


Excellent yatsek!
Why wouldn't you post this re-statement in the General Forum?

Because British/American culture includes answering a particular question instead of ignoring it or making a mess by producing meaningless talk. And the headline of this thread reads, “How should (European) peak names be spelled?”

It's never been me who feels unhappy because other SP members spell toponyms differently. To my mind, if someone feels uncomfortable with the English language and culture, why don't they look for fulfillment and happiness on a non-English site? (And I'm not referring to those who choose not to speak on the forum.)
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby Nanuls » Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:38 am

visentin wrote:
Nanuls wrote:Simple.


Nanuls, to make a better example, what would you say if for example a page about Buachaille Etive Mòr was titled "Great herdsman of Etive" ?
Sure that's correct English, but what about the ethic of places names I am trying to raise here ?


Come on Eric, use some common sense, no one calls Buachaille Etive Mòr the Great herdsman of Etive.

I wrote the following in my above post, it applies here.

...also don't just translate the name into English for no other reason than this is an English language site. If it's not known by an English name, then there's no need to give it one.


Cheers
Dan
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby visentin » Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:06 pm

...also don't just translate the name into English for no other reason than this is an English language site. If it's not known by an English name, then there's no need to give it one.

That's exactly what I wanted to summarize. Of course Scottish names were only an example, but there are other parts of Europe where in my opinion original names are excessively translated.
Talking abotu English/American culture and stuff in my opinion derives from the topic and cannot justify inventing names. Sorry if one particular person feels referred, but it's not the target of this thread. It only inspired me discussing this issue and there are far many more cases I saw on this site.
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby phlipdascrip » Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:44 pm

Fletch wrote:Unfortunately, European languages are dying (birthrates <2.1 means there are less and less people who speak French, German, Italian, etc everyday). In 100 years the whole world will speak English, Chinese, Arabic, and Spanish... It's unfortunate, but it's the truth...

1. I'm not sure you got the concept of birth rates right.
2. There are more languages in the world than the ones spoken in North America, Europe, the Middle East, and China.
3. Carry on...
:wink:
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Re: How should (European) peak names be spelled ?

Postby yatsek » Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:48 pm

visentin wrote:…other parts of Europe where in my opinion original names are excessively translated.(…)inventing names(…) far many more cases I saw on this site.

Here, as of 5th post and here :?:

Someone’s been seeing things, I’ve said that before.

visentin wrote: Sorry if one particular person feels referred, but it's not the target of this thread. It only inspired me

I suppose so.
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