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New LA Times Report on The Station Fire

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New LA Times Report on The Station Fire

Postby EManBevHills » Sat Oct 31, 2009 11:12 pm

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Postby fossana » Sat Oct 31, 2009 11:43 pm

Along tangential lines, I thought this Fresh Air interview with Timothy Egan about his book on the 1910 fire that torched 3 million acres in 36 hours & subsequent Forest Service burn policy was interesting:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... =114248029
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Postby butitsadryheat » Mon Nov 02, 2009 7:00 am

I almost thought we'd go through a whole post without seeing it... :lol:




great links above. Thanks to both of you.
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Postby ksolem » Tue Nov 03, 2009 2:17 am

The way the article describes it, the helo’s were available and the men were on scene but the bosses sat on their hands. While the article mentions that BLM decided to cut spending on local and county units there is no indication that was the case in this fire. If the unidentified source is right, they let it jump the road and run uphill when they might have stopped it by taking action earlier.

In the case of this fire it does not appear that a lack of resources or funds affected the outcome, but rather just plain bad decision making by the officials on scene. Paying these guys more won’t change that any more than it would change your companions’ wonderful attitude towards his civic duties.

I could easily get the license plate numbers, but he snickered, "I'm not on the job."


Of course the government will blame any failure on its part on lack of funds.

Last week I walked up out of Monrovia Canyon from home, up and over the crest past Monrovia peak and out to the edge of the burned area. This fire was hugely destructive, burning large forests of old oaks and pines to dust. If it turns out it could have been stopped but was let go by incompetence it is very sad indeed. I hope there is a fair investigation, the article is basically built on one unidentified source.
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Postby phydeux » Tue Nov 03, 2009 3:29 am

1000Pks wrote:That smoke obscured my views all the way into Utah!

On a similar note, with budget issues, that's what you get when government is forced to cut expenses. Not having the incentives, benefits, and salary for the best, you get lesser thought and actions. You can have fires acted upon right away, but the State had a budget crisis, and still does. The vote of the people. So many once essential services are curtailed or reduced. Then, it's a world wide recession, other countries wouldn't do as well, as even the people here. They had a huge fire in SE Asia and also in Australia back a few years ago. Global warming is blamed by some, too.

You get what you pay for. Law enforcement can't catch such people (as the one who set the blaze). On another note, I was driving to the peaks when some guy ahead of me threw out a burning cigarette. I asked my companion, a believable, high ranking state official, "if we should get this guy." I could easily get the license plate numbers, but he snickered, "I'm not on the job." That same area burned a few days later, who knows by the same idiot. MLC SC by the way.


Uh, hate to correct you, but the Station Fire was in the federally controlled Angeles NATIONAL Forest, not a state park, so the Feds were the ones who had first call on it (incident command was turned over to the local agencies about the time it got out of control). Also, no local firefighters had been furloughed at the time of the fire. Pay of local firefighters? I only wish I was making the pay and benefits they do. I should have skipped college and spent six months-one year in firefighter/paramedic training. And its not as dangerous as the 'marketed image' portrays it to be after you get the training. Most jobs or activities that seem dangerous on first look are not that bad when you get the training to do them; for example, what does the average person on the street think about rock climbing?
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Postby butitsadryheat » Tue Nov 03, 2009 5:25 am

butitsadryheat wrote:I almost thought we'd go through a whole post (again) without seeing it... :lol:
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Postby jesu, joy of man's desiring » Tue Nov 03, 2009 5:47 am

...with all due respect, I'm beginning to think that some of our govt civil servants just don't have the sophistication or education to deal with complex situations like the Station Fire. USFS could have nipped this one in the bud, and saved us 100 million dollars. Put people of Caltech/JPL caliber in the critical decision-making positions for these situations, and you would get better outcomes.

What really kills me is that the (probable) arsonist could have been stopped. That transient guy who looks like The Wildman of Borneo, from Spanky and Our Gang, was DETAINED by USFS employees for starting the tiny Ladybug Fire, but then he "escaped" by running down a canyon. An escaped arsonist? Could not the USFS simply have called in the Sheriffs Dept, a few scent hounds and a helicopter to find and capture this guy, within hours? It might have saved us the Station Fire, six days later.

--STEVE
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Postby EManBevHills » Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:15 pm

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Update

Postby EManBevHills » Wed Sep 15, 2010 6:46 pm

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Re: New LA Times Report on The Station Fire

Postby EManBevHills » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:59 pm

Here's the latest, once again from the LA Times:

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me ... 0902.story
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Re: New LA Times Report on The Station Fire

Postby EManBevHills » Wed Oct 13, 2010 7:36 pm

And now the report on yesterday's hearing:
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me ... 1976.story
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Re: New LA Times Report on The Station Fire

Postby Augie Medina » Wed Oct 13, 2010 8:30 pm

That last article posted by EMan (Congressional panel interviews) reflects that the person in charge of operations the second day did timely call for air tankers but got no response to his request. Those at the facility where the request was received claim not to know who handled the request and apparently ignored it or denied it without telling anyone. It is of course laughable that they claim they can't track down who took that call. The plot thickens.

I sense the role of SC MLC somewhere here :lol:
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