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New fees for National Parks

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New fees for National Parks

Postby Bob Burd » Wed Oct 25, 2017 5:45 pm

Get ready for the $70 entrance fee coming to a park near you:
https://parkplanning.nps.gov/projectHom ... ctId=75576
Comment period lasts for 30 days. Make yours now:
https://parkplanning.nps.gov/commentFor ... ntID=83652
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby mrchad9 » Wed Oct 25, 2017 6:29 pm

The NPS is so out of control and so mismanaged I have to tip my hat to the guys who just put a fee stub on their dashboard and skip the payment. Only catch is you have to enter when no one is at the shack. But it makes sense... these people are an even bigger disaster than those in the NFS. It's a close race but the national parks can't be topped.

The US is one of the few places that charges residents and non-residents the same fees for all its nationals parks, sights, museums, etc... Maybe if they just charge non-residents 5 times as much they wouldn't have to impact everyone who pays taxes here. That's what other countries too.

Pretty bizarre as well that this is to pay for "maintenance". Mountains, lakes, and wilderness do not need to be maintained. All the other things they can put in the trash for all I care... it isn't needed.
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby seano » Wed Oct 25, 2017 7:00 pm

What a dumb way to pay for park maintenance. I'll bet our "beautiful" border wall won't be paid for by nickel-and-dime fees charged to everyone driving through one of those annoying checkpoints 20 miles north of the border...
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby DukeJH » Wed Oct 25, 2017 8:33 pm

Buy the annual pass. It's one of the few values left.

I remember my first trip into SEKI over Army Pass. I expected a pay booth but only saw a sign.
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby Scott M. » Wed Oct 25, 2017 8:43 pm

If the following from CNN's report remains true it will be senseless to buy anything but the annual pass if you plan at least two entries per year to the featured list of locations.
From CNN Travel: "The cost of the annual pass, which permits entrance into all federal lands and parks, would remain at $80."
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby Bob Burd » Wed Oct 25, 2017 9:15 pm

The $80 annual pass will not remain $80 if the new fees go into effect, of that you can be sure. Once they see that the crowds will still come, the annual pass will be the next obvious target.
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby jdzaharia » Wed Oct 25, 2017 9:31 pm

So, under that proposal, visitors to those 17 parks, during their peak times, will be subsidizing the entire balance of the NPS system?
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby mrchad9 » Wed Oct 25, 2017 10:20 pm

Bob is correct... annual pass will be a target shortly.

Seniors used to be able to buy lifetime passes for $10... and just last August that went up to $80. I wouldn't be surprised if annual passes soon go up to $140 or more. They will be looking at all these people visiting Yosemite and Yellowstone willing to pay $70 for a week and it won't be long before they realize they can squeeze everyone for $140 a year. In the long run they will keep annual passes about double a single entry... just raising one a bit before the other.

I think this is all part of the (successful) plan to keep Americans fat and lazy.
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby lcarreau » Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:50 am

Chad is correct. The American taxpayer gets screwed again, but it's even a BIGGER shame the singer who sang "Ain't It a Shame" Chubby Checker died today at 89.
"Phobos and Deimos went to Mars, and that's the last time I saw those two dudes."
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby Bob Sihler » Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:30 am

mrchad9 wrote:
I think this is all part of the (successful) plan to keep Americans fat and lazy.


Usually, I laugh at conspiracy theories and those who buy into them, but given what the current administration has been up to regarding public lands, I have to wonder if this is an attempt to erode support for public lands and make it easier to sell or lease them.

The national parks are sometimes a shitshow, but they still open the outdoors to people of almost all means at a great value. These increases could price a lot of families out. Theodore Roosevelt would have shut this down.
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby boyblue » Thu Oct 26, 2017 6:38 am

I bought a Senior Pass last July at Crater Lake NP for $10. I knew it was slated to increase dramatically by the end of the year, so this was a high priority on our visit. Certainly one of the best returns I'll ever have for such a small investment. :-) Just need to stay in reasonable shape and health until my retirement in a few years (and beyond) so I can really make good use of it.

FYI, I paid a lot of visits to the local NPs in California back in the 70's and 80's. I think daily fees were only about $2.00 a vehicle back then- increasing to a whopping $5.00 a vehicle by the end of that period. I usually bought a Golden Eagle every year for about $15.00 to save some money. The 1982 equivalent to 2017's $70 was almost $30. I'm pretty sure I would have paid it and sacrificed some of my other pleasures such as records and video rentals- maybe even alcohol and weed (I don't know. I'm glad I didn't have to make that decision :o ).
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby chicagotransplant » Thu Oct 26, 2017 6:43 pm

My dad got the 65+ pass for $10 a few years ago, great deal! Sad to see that went up 8 fold.

I had the RMNP season pass when I was still chasing a lot of the 13K peaks in the park, but as I moved on to other areas in the state I haven't gotten it again, I think it was $40 last time I got it. Its now up to $60.

Certainly the trend seems to be moving to increase the use fees, especially in light of the current budget cutting NPS funding by like 12%. I think that is the percentage I read anyway (sorry, no source).

Most of my NPS visits involve parking at a trailhead, hiking, and maybe using the trailhead bathroom. Is that really worth $70? I do the same thing at countless other trailheads on National Forest or BLM land with no fee. Sure not all of them have a toilet, but a good number do and are still "free". I know, its not really free because of my income taxes but that is where I would rather pay for it.

I personally think the a-la-carte type of fees are a bad model and would rather the parks are funded by our income taxes. They are a benefit for everyone, even if they choose not visit, and to me it makes sense to keep them paid for by everyone. Not just hit up the people who visit them with higher and higher fees. My thought would be if they really need to increase fees to cover their budgets, why not just increase everyone's income taxes by $80 (the current rate of the annual pass) and you don't have to pay an entrance fee?
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby mstender » Thu Oct 26, 2017 9:32 pm

lcarreau wrote:but it's even a BIGGER shame the singer who sang "Ain't It a Shame" Chubby Checker died today at 89.

It was Fats Domino who died yesterday at the age of 89.
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby lcarreau » Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:03 am

mstender wrote:
lcarreau wrote:but it's even a BIGGER shame the singer who sang "Ain't It a Shame" Chubby Checker died today at 89.

It was Fats Domino who died yesterday at the age of 89.


Great eyes ! There I go listening to Fake news again ... won't reveal the source, because I don't want to turn this thread into another political slug-fest.

Actually, it's all Teddy Roosevelt's fault ... :wink:
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Re: New fees for National Parks

Postby stinkysox77 » Mon Oct 30, 2017 2:35 pm

lcarreau wrote:Chad is correct. The American taxpayer gets screwed again, but it's even a BIGGER shame the singer who sang "Ain't It a Shame" Chubby Checker died today at 89.


The average taxpayer was the once getting screwed before the price increase. Why not make the people use the park pay for the park? Personally I'm tired of a disproportionately small percentage of americans benefiting from the national parks when every american is having to pay for them. It doesn't seem that unreasonable to have the people who visit the parks pay for the upkeep and maintenance of the parks.
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