What knot to use when joining cords together so you can rap down a few pitches?

How do you get past the knot? gulp

I am Knot a "Big Wally" sort of guy. The few times I have needed to do this, we used double fisherman knots, my partner left the ends long enuf to make two looped steps. When you got to the knot, you stuck your feet in the loops, put on a prussic (we didn't have jumars) to take your weight off your device, undo it, than reclip in below the knot. The loop steps really helped to get your weight off and steady yourself while swinging, rotating around in space.

And something else. What is the best knot to use when you need to tie ropes of two different diameters together, like a 5/6 mil accessory cord and a 9.5 lead line?

Geez Guyzo, I thought you knew all this stuff, after 35 years of climbing.

I like the Euro Death Knot. It's quick and easy to tie, and unties easy too.

Rob, hi. I like to keep up. Thanks for the photo of the EKD. I tie another one right on top of the first, but only backward, so it's backed up.

I was joining some spectra slings together the other day and it was pointed out to me that you can not, should not, do that with that stuff. That was news to me. So I have been updating myself, I was even using a Grigri while sport climbing the other day

What next? GPS? Radios?

Guyzo wrote:What knot to use when joining cords together so you can rap down a few pitches?

How do you get past the knot? gulp

The footloop method you outlined would obviously work, but it eats up rope, and those long ends with (pre-tied, I assume) footloops could be a snag hazard. A more modern way of doing it would be the following:

1) Rap to with 6-12" of the knot
2) Lock off
3) tie in short below the knot
4) Place a prussik just above the friction device
5) Using a double length sling (unless you used a really long prussik loop), connect the prussik to your belay loop with a munter-mule on a locker
6) Rap a couple more inches until the prussik takes your weight
7) Disconnect the rap device and rig it just below the knot, lock it off
Undo the mule stopper knot and use the munter on the sling connected to your prussik to lower until the weight comes back onto the rap device
9) Remove the prussik
10) Undo the short tie-in
11) Unblock your friction device and continue on

If using a friction knot backup, that would get untied and moved to below the knot int he process.

Guyzo wrote:What is the best knot to use when you need to tie ropes of two different diameters together, like a 5/6 mil accessory cord and a 9.5 lead line?

The double fisherman's.

BTW, I'm sure you already know that the triple fisherman's is the standard for connecting spectra cord.

Guyzo wrote:What is the best knot to use when you need to tie ropes of two different diameters together, like a 5/6 mil accessory cord and a 9.5 lead line?

I use this (click on the images for larger format):

[quote="Rob"]Geez Guyzo, I thought you knew all this stuff, after 35 years of climbing.

I like the Euro Death Knot. It's quick and easy to tie, and unties easy too.

[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a5/Sackstich_Tropfen.jpg/180p


The tail on this one looks way short. If I recall correctly 12-18 inches is recommended for the edk.

KISS.....Keep It Simple Stupid! You start doing fancy knots and you'll fuck up one day. You'll be getting off some heinous mtn it horrible conditions with a decreased mental capacity and....woops! The Euro Death knot is simple...and it works. Fishermans is also simple. No need to even consider other knots. That brain space could be better occupied thinking about women....or beer....

Riverman....thanks for the link, good info.

And to Iceisnice...I agree 1000% I hate it when partners have all sorts of screwy knots....

ME: " what sort of deal is that?"

EX: " it's a Tratters knot, learned it in the navy - it unties like this!"

ME: " lets rap down out of here "

I figure there are only four knots you need to know. Figure Eight, EKD, Clove Hitch and Water Knot.

It is best to keep it really simple.

Double Clove Hitch to tie yourself off real quick to belay,
Figure eight to tie in
Prussik knot to get your ass/your partners out of a fire
Water knot to create slings
Overhand doubled up for sketchy repels where you think it will hang
Double Fishermens, never fails
Muntor, for quick belaying on a biner without spending tons of time going through stich plate/figure-8

I have used them all. They all have a place to be used. Its the difference between being able to climb quickly and taking forever at repel/belay stations

Brian

Guyzo wrote:Riverman....thanks for the link, good info.

And to Iceisnice...I agree 1000% I hate it when partners have all sorts of screwy knots....

ME: " what sort of deal is that?"

EX: " it's a Tratters knot, learned it in the navy - it unties like this!"

ME: " lets rap down out of here "

I figure there are only four knots you need to know. Figure Eight, EKD, Clove Hitch and Water Knot.

It is best to keep it really simple.

tie a double fishermans knot.

easy to untie, always works great

http://animatedknots.com/doublefisherma ... dknots.com

DMT...thx, that sounds really simple.

And what is a "double clove hitch"

Guyzo wrote:And what is a "double clove hitch"

Clover with three loops-- throw the second behind the first (i.e. normal clove) and then the third behind the second.

I agree with the guy that said KEEP IT SIMPLE!!

Dont do any fancy knots that are time consuming and that you could get wrong.
Dont use a double or triple fishermans for the above reason,plus its a large knot, so when your pulling your ropes through, their is more of a chance they will get jammed.

A overhand knot with 12-18 inch tails is fine. If your worried back it up with another overhand knot. Simple, and can be tied in thirty seconds or so!!

There is a reason it's call the Euro Death Knot. But I use it the majority of the time.

Tying two ropes together to toprope long Indian Creek pitches, NO EDK, triple fishermans

Tying my 9 mil lead line to the 5 mil static to rap alpine rock, YES with backup.

Tying my 9 mil lead line to the 5 mil static to rap in the mountains, where I might get caught in a slough slide, and significantly increase the load, NO EDK. Other knots that are flat and stable under increased loads work great.

Sure, KISS. But most of us are smart enough to know how to tie more than 4 or 5 kinds of knots. And smart enough to know when they offer advantages. And smart enough to know when a partner will lesser skills needs to be educated about new knots, or placated with the old stanbys.