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Mts of East Central and SE Europe

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Postby andreeacorodeanu » Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:25 am

Thank you Jacek :) ! In the shortest version, this happenend:

We started around 11 30 am. We find a lot of snow in many places till my knee. We had sun till the shepard refuge and maybe another hour more so about 3 4 hours and after we got in the white out, so bad. Hard to find the way but we manage. In the place where we should descend very steep to the Iezer refuge around 7 30, 8 pm I decide even that one guy didnt agree... to go back or to find a place in the snow for sleep. Why??????? I smell that we can cause a big avalanch, too many wind plates (english?) so obvious that could be dislocate so easy. One friend of mine from the reascue team told me today that in one year his dog caused an avalanch there. Anyway the wind start and snowing too and didnt worth to risk ... more that next day even that was a beautiful one, we couldnt climb all the ridge with all that snow for sure.

So we climb for 12 hours, we arrived back to the shepard refuge at 11 30 in the night.

Well how I say always the mountain remain there and we can try again when we have better conditions.
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Postby visentin » Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:47 am

yatsek wrote:Are you sure that's non-Carpathian? :lol:

The books language is, at least, Carpathian :)

Coming back to wood, you once showed me a link about wood architecture in Europe (the discussion was about advantages of the wood as a construction material), but I can't find it anymore. Do you still have it ?
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Postby visentin » Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:51 am

Just started a new game :)
http://www.summitpost.org/custom-object ... -alps.html
As I haven't been in this aera, I'd be more than happy to share it with others !
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Postby yatsek » Mon Mar 15, 2010 11:40 am

andreeacorodeanu wrote:too many wind plates (english?) so obvious that could be dislocate so easy. One friend of mine from the reascue team told me today that in one year his dog caused an avalanch there.

Do you mean cornices?
Falling cornices might have triggered one of the deadliest avalanches in the Karkonosze, Sudetes in March 1968. Here's a report by a witness, unfortunately in Polish. The next March – while on my first solo hike at 12 years old (now I know how old I was then thanks to that tragedy) after cheating my parents a bit about where I was going) – I was passing by a monument raised to commemorate the victims. In a few years the monument was destroyed by another avalanche.

Very wise of you to have turned back. And thanks a lot for the TR above.
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Postby andreeacorodeanu » Mon Mar 15, 2010 11:55 am

Not cornices, I dont know in english...snow formed by wind from where can broke and fall in big plates hmmmm... in romanian we say "placi de vant", but not cornices hmmmmmmmm, uffff...
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Postby yatsek » Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:24 pm

visentin wrote:Coming back to wood, you once showed me a link about wood architecture in Europe (the discussion was about advantages of the wood as a construction material), but I can't find it anymore. Do you still have it ?

I remember I was surprised to find out that as they said stone houses were for the better-off because of the high cost of heating. But I'm afraid I can't find it either :( I only have something related. :)
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Postby yatsek » Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:38 pm

andreeacorodeanu wrote:Not cornices, I dont know in english...snow formed by wind from where can broke and fall in big plates hmmmm... in romanian we say "placi de vant", but not cornices hmmmmmmmm, uffff...

Now I see :) Perhaps the most accurate term will be wind slabs, or just "snow slabs"
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Postby kamil » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:00 pm

Some interesting stories here...
Those slabs - is it what we call "deski sniezne"?
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Postby andreeacorodeanu » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:12 pm

Yes Jacek those :D ! Thanks so much, now I know the term in english :D !!!!
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Postby yatsek » Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:25 pm

kamil wrote:Some interesting stories here...

We're trying to improve European Communication. :D
kamil wrote:Those slabs - is it what we call "deski sniezne"?

I have little winter experience but I guess the Polish "deska sniezna" refers to a soft slab as described in the 1st paragraph here while what Andreea was talking about is probably the classic wind slabs that form on the lee side - Andreea :?: (The latter probably translates as "lawina ze sniegu osiadlego")
andreeacorodeanu wrote: now I know the term in english :D !!!!

Me too - thank you Andreea :D

BTW A good video - click "Filmy" in the bottom right-hand corner - especially part 02 seems both helpful and interesting, not only to skiers and snowboarders. And a relevant pic on page 9, i.e. 28 here (plus some more on the following pages)
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Postby visentin » Tue Mar 16, 2010 7:53 am

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Postby yatsek » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:39 am

kamil wrote:Those slabs - is it what we call "deski sniezne"?

Now I've read more Polish texts about that (e.g. this by GOPR - it looks like anybody has their own classification of avalanches, but my conclusion, supported by common sense, is that you were right: "deski sniezne" are just "snow slabs" :)
What's more important than terminology is - I'll quote Gilles Brunot: "the majority of avalanche accidents are not caused by wind slab but that most slab avalanches are due to weaknesses in the snow pack, whether they have been formed under the action of wind or not. "
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Postby visentin » Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:10 am

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Postby yatsek » Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:42 am

visentin wrote:http://www.mbpost.com/trail/275372/cracow-valleys-circuit.html

:D Do you think you could make a Dolina Bolechowicka album for SP? It won't take you a minute. Those EC European crags do deserve it.
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Postby visentin » Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:49 am

yatsek wrote:
visentin wrote:http://www.mbpost.com/trail/275372/cracow-valleys-circuit.html

:D Do you think you could make a Dolina Bolechowicka album for SP? It won't take you a minute. Those EC European crags do deserve it.

I'll think of it. There are a couple of Jura pages to which I can attach it, but here again, perhaps these pages deserve a bit more...
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