The Chief wrote:

Steve1215 wrote:--
A lot of us, for a lot of reasons, just cannot be totally dedicated to climbing.
--

Oh really. Then WTF are you doing ragging on others for doing just the same as they?

Hypocritical and totally oxymoron post there STEVE1215!!!

People who are totally dedicated to climbing are called professional climbers

If you climb less than 320 days a year...surely you are not totally dedicated to climbing.

Need to read between the lines in this thread--I don't give a f-ck what anybody does...as long as they ain't an A-hole!

-

Steve1215 wrote:If you climb less than 320 days a year...surely you are not totally dedicated to climbing.-

Who set that criteria... 320 days?

Last year I climbed 302 days, does that make me not dedicated? The year before, around 305, so far this year I have 36 days, etc etc...

Steve1215 wrote:But people were doing 5.13s in 79 and 80, without hangdogging...

Odd, Jardine worked the Phoenix for well over 2 months before sending it.

Tony Yaniro worked Grand Illusion for a month or so before sending that.

Wolfgang worked many of his .14's for many months before sending them.

Etc Etc Etc.....


These were the dudes that invented "Handogging" back in the late 70's.

Hell, I remember reading an old Climbing Mag article back in the mid 90's on Pete Cleveland and his incredible work in Devils Lake back in the late 70's early 80's. His method of choice was to TR the moves repeatedly prior to leading and then sending the line.

C'mon Steve, bring your old cranky self up north and let's train for Southern Belle! That is my 'hang it up and move to Maui' climb...but I was born in 1983 so I must be a wimp (albeit a wimp with a dream! ).

jeeze Steve, you are flip flopping more than Obama during his campaign. are you trying to pull a "the Chief" on us? are you that bored in San Marino? aren't there nice tennis courts to get a few forehands in?

Is this thread still alive?

goldenhopper wrote:Is this thread still alive?

Alive and kicking..... dude.

Steve ... nothing stays the same in life.

I get a completely different adventure from climbing now, from the one, I found when I was 25.

And Chief.... it's a sport.

Ernest Hemingway, said it best.

Guyzo wrote:And Chief.... it's a sport.

Ernest Hemingway, said it best.

JB said it better...

"If this was a sport, I would have retired from the sport a long time ago."

His and I discussion of this very thing at the MMS parking lot Oct '08.

goldenhopper wrote:Is this thread still alive?

Oh, yeah. Ol' Steve keeps it going. . .

--

Listen, folks, I wish this thread was dead. I don't remember half the shit I said in it and I'm too lazy to go back and read it. Half-way thru I got bored and started saying tongue-in-cheek bullshit, so maybe that sounds like flip-flopping.

I'm sure climbers from the 1930s lectured climbers in the 1950s, and 1950s climbers thought 1970s climbers had it waaay too easy.

The path to climbing spiritual enlightenment isn't just sleeping face down in the dirt in Camp 4 and eating 10,000 peanut butter sandwiches. George Lowe I think was a full-time materials engineer and researcher, did the FA of North Twin NF and Alberta's NF, and was never a dirtbag climber. The path to climbing nirvana is different for different folks. Even weekend climbers can attain it. Hard to balance career and family with TOTAL dedication to climbing.

Yeah, Jardine invented hangdogging, but got flak for it from Kauk and Bachar and the Stonemasters. I heard Tony Yaniro personally describe how he ground-up did The Pirate, placing wireds on lead and taking long whippers and lowering off and starting all over again; 12d in 1978, I think. As far as I know, actual true hangdogging was a big NO-NO until the actual sport revolution came on. I'm sure Yaniro did not hangdog on Grand Illusion.

--

WHOOO CARES!!!

Call yourselves whatever you want! Just stop this effing thread!

WE GET IT.

Steve and Guy and Fatdad - YOU'RE SO MUCH MORE BADASS THAN WE ARE! WE COULD NEVER BE AS COOL AS YOU! IM GOING TO QUIT MY JOB, JUMP IN A 21 WINDOW VW, GET A BANDANA AND SOME SHORT SHORTS AND DRINK COORS PULLTOPS IN TUOLUMNE MEADOWS FOR THE NEXT 30 YEARS. ONLY THEN, MAY I ASPIRE TO BE WORTHY OF THE STATUS AS A TRUE CLIMBER.

Please guys, try and grow old gracefully...

Fletch wrote:WHOOO CARES!!!

Call yourselves whatever you want! Just stop this effing thread!

WE GET IT.

Steve and Guy and Fatdad - YOU'RE SO MUCH MORE BADASS THAN WE ARE! WE COULD NEVER BE AS COOL AS YOU! IM GOING TO QUIT MY JOB, JUMP IN A 21 WINDOW VW, GET A BANDANA AND SOME SHORT SHORTS AND DRINK COORS PULLTOPS IN TUOLUMNE MEADOWS FOR THE NEXT 30 YEARS. ONLY THEN, MAY I ASPIRE TO BE WORTHY OF THE STATUS AS A TRUE CLIMBER.

Please guys, try and grow old gracefully...

Mr. Fletch..... So why all the shouting?

You accuse the three of us of many false things.

I always thought Summitpost, was a climbers web site.

What should we have meaningless internet chats about?

And if your going for a VW, get a water-cooled model, much faster.

Guyzo wrote:Mr. Fletch..... So why all the shouting?

You accuse the three of us of many false things.

I always thought Summitpost, was a climbers web site.

What should we have meaningless internet chats about?

And if your going for a VW, get a water-cooled model, much faster.

Sorry for the shouting, it just seems that every thread lately is some derivation of the old "back in my day" speech. It's just getting old, that's all. And on a deeper level, it shows arrogance and a distinctive lack of self awareness. But I see your point, what else we gonna talk about?

I think what steve1215 is probing is a serious issue with climbers.

That issue is motivation.

Another is change, and changing times.

Most of the serious stuff here gets shut out by cheap ass - stabbing and flaming and name calling.

Sometimes it seems the flamers didn't read before sparking up the torch.

But that is the way it goes sometimes.

Fletch, THX for the quick love,

This is a day for all of us SP people to be humble

The Chief wrote:

Guyzo wrote:And Chief.... it's a sport.

Ernest Hemingway, said it best.

JB said it better...

"If this was a sport, I would have retired from the sport a long time ago."

His and I discussion of this very thing at the MMS parking lot Oct '08.

Rick, JB was a nice person, who lived his life on his terms.

You should cherish the time you spent with John.

I know I do.

Guyzo wrote:Rick, JB was a nice person, who lived his life on his terms.

As I do and how everyone should. That is the other thing that we both saw eye to eye on.

I cherish my time spent with all folks, no more or less depending on who you are/were. JB was no different nor more special than any of the many fallen spirits I was previleged to serve with.


Seems that is the bottom line of this thread. No one is better or worse than anyone else that ties into a rope and then takes off onto the vertical world of the rock/ice/snow. No matter how long one has been at it or what grade/rating they have achieved.

BTW, JB always reminded me during the winter months when we would run into one another on the "hill", how he thought that anyone that climbed ice, was a complete lunatic. That comment had absolutely nothing to do whether it was a sport nor how long one had been doing it.




Early....