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IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

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IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

Postby Aaron Johnson » Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:21 pm

If you're concerned about the ongoing fee debacle, be sure to read the lastest news from WSNF:

IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES
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Re: IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

Postby Tonka » Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:28 pm

I just put 4300 miles on my car and hit 8 National parks and many other monuments and forests. This is an problem that is not going away. I have no issue at all paying for my annual NPS pass or spending money that goes to protect our wild lands but I have a big issue with company X making a profit off our public lands while not contributing to their protection.
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Re: IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

Postby Aaron Johnson » Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:24 am

Hi Tonka-I'm with you-I don't have a problem with the NPS system. I think it's wonderful.

You're right about the illegal fee scammers though-it's not going away as long as there are greedy private interests out there, but victories can be won, one step at a time. The recent victory at Mount Lemon (AZ) forced the FS to change the rules at Mount Evans (the case I was involved with), and several other victories have been won. Corporate interests are weasling their way into the money where ever they can. The WSNF will be there to greet them at every turn.

SP member photohiker is now involved as I was and contacted me about a case going on in his neck of the woods-Montana. WSNF has taken up the torch in partnership with his skiing club. Check out the WSNF web site for more info and take heart. It CAN be done!
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Re: IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

Postby Buz Groshong » Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:47 pm

The problem is not just concessionaires. I went out to CO recently and at one National Forest trailhead we were greeted with a sign that said we had to pay $5 to park in a gravel parking area. There were no facilities, just a wide place in the road. They were essentially charging an entrance fee. Fortunately they did honor our golden old farts passes.
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Re: IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

Postby Aaron Johnson » Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:16 pm

Hey Buz-

The concessionaire cannot charge you only for parking anyway, regrdless whether you have a pass. You can park anywhere on FS land to access the wilderness or hiking trails, including a parking area without having to pay a fee. You must use other amenities readily available at the site in order to be obligated to pay the fee.

Get the word out. Unless you use an amenity specified in the FLREA (Federal Lands Recreation Enhancement Act), you are not obligated to pay a fee. If someone gives you a ticket, it's not a ticket. It's a notice of non-compliance. Do not comply. Simply take the notice and leave when you are ready to leave. DO NOT PAY THE FEE if you do not use an amenity (and there are 6 that are supposed to be present).

The WSNF web site has plenty of info on this matter.

Happy trails!
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Re: IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

Postby km_donovan » Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:59 pm

I took a group from work last weekend to hike up Mount Evans and it is apparent that the Forest Service is still collecting fees from the uninformed. The road was marked as "Open" but the gate was closed at Summit Lake. There were lots of cars coming up a turning around at the lot and driving back down without stopping. All I saw were displaying the their fee paid sticker. A large number of vehicles coming up had red fleet tags so they were rentals displaying fee paid stickers in the windshield.

There should be a sign/billboard that tells people that the fees are not required to drive on a state highway. Earlier this year I had a conversation with one of the Rangers regarding the fees and his comment was "You know too much". This would lead me to believe that the Forest Service is attempting to continue with "business as usual" in spite of the recent Forest Service "agreement". I think this needs a investigative reporter to film an exchange between them and the FS.

BTW: We parked on the state highway that we already pay taxes for.
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Re: IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

Postby Buz Groshong » Mon Sep 17, 2012 3:47 pm

Aaron Johnson wrote:Hey Buz-

The concessionaire cannot charge you only for parking anyway, regrdless whether you have a pass. You can park anywhere on FS land to access the wilderness or hiking trails, including a parking area without having to pay a fee. You must use other amenities readily available at the site in order to be obligated to pay the fee.

Get the word out. Unless you use an amenity specified in the FLREA (Federal Lands Recreation Enhancement Act), you are not obligated to pay a fee. If someone gives you a ticket, it's not a ticket. It's a notice of non-compliance. Do not comply. Simply take the notice and leave when you are ready to leave. DO NOT PAY THE FEE if you do not use an amenity (and there are 6 that are supposed to be present).

The WSNF web site has plenty of info on this matter.

Happy trails!


I was all ready to say piss on their fee, but the car was rented to my buddy and he's not quite the old codger that I am. The sign did say, though, that if you had golden eagle or golden old farts pass you didn't need to pay, so my buddy filled out the envelope and indicated that he had the pass. I agree about the amenities; the law does not allow them to charge for nothing more than parking.

Happy trails to you too!
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Re: IMPORTANT NEW INFORMATION ON ILLEGAL FEES

Postby helmut » Fri Sep 21, 2012 6:01 pm

So if I pee on the ground I don't have to pay the fee, but if I use a vault toilet I do?

Did the WSNF lawyers charged them a fee for writing up the formal complaint document? I'd be more worried about lawyer fees, then paying 5 dollars to pee in the forest.
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