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NPS vs. BLM

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NPS vs. BLM

Postby Bob Burd » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:05 pm

The National Parks Service is known for good pavement, cheerful rangers, well-signed and maintained trails, clean bathrooms in nicely appointed Visitor Centers and other swell amenities along with somewhat pricey entrance fees. To keep people safe from the Wilderness experience, Caution is a serious concern for the NPS:

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The Bureau of Land Management, on the other hand, is known for almost none of these amenities. Hardly any fences or fees or even pavement for that matter, overseeing land that the NPS and most other Americans aren't interested in. You want to kill yourself on BLM land? Go right ahead:

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I kinda like their attitude... :wink:
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby mrchad9 » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:18 pm

This is my favorite warning sign in Yosemite. The current is stretching this poor fellow out as he approaches the waterfall's event horizon.

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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby chugach mtn boy » Sun Dec 16, 2012 1:29 am

It's helpful when they point out the dangers along the way:

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But unfortunately, even the signs are not safe from the many perils of the wilderness:

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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby McCannster » Sun Dec 16, 2012 8:47 pm

BLM=dirtbag friendly. NPS, not so much.
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby MoapaPk » Sun Dec 16, 2012 10:47 pm

There is a great sign near Maroon Bells, shows a guy with crampons and ice tools climbing rock.

I love all the warning signs near the Grand Canyon, advising the dangers of hiking down with inadequate water, and misjudging the requirements of hiking back uphill after descending to the river. We should have lawyers at the top of the canyon, helping people sue for not getting enough warnings. That's the American way -- dumb shit behavior followed by lawsuits.
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby boyblue » Sun Dec 16, 2012 11:19 pm

Bob Burd wrote:The Bureau of Land Management, on the other hand, is known for almost none of these amenities. Hardly any fences or fees or even pavement for that matter, overseeing land that the NPS and most other Americans aren't interested in. You want to kill yourself on BLM land? Go right ahead


You mean we have to use common sense?! We're DUH... DUH... DOOMED! :shock:
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby Clark_Griswold » Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:42 pm

The Bureau of Logging and Mining is way more hands off than the Park Service, so they just let you do what you want. I think you can still homestead and mine on BLM lands. Not so for the Park Service.
...
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby Buz Groshong » Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:07 pm

MoapaPk wrote:There is a great sign near Maroon Bells, shows a guy with crampons and ice tools climbing rock.

I love all the warning signs near the Grand Canyon, advising the dangers of hiking down with inadequate water, and misjudging the requirements of hiking back uphill after descending to the river. We should have lawyers at the top of the canyon, helping people sue for not getting enough warnings. That's the American way -- dumb shit behavior followed by lawsuits.


Most of those who hike into the Grand Canyon are tourons who don't hike regularly; also many are idiots. To get a permit to camp in the canyon you are sent a video warning of the dangers, those who don't know as much as experienced campers only have the signs to warn them. The warning signs would be helpful except that those who should read them don't.

Most of those who suffer dehydration in the canyon are women - they don't drink water so they won't have to pee in public. If the park wanted to actually do something about the dangers, they would install latrines along the Bright Angel Trail.
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby Brian C » Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:26 pm

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Don't think this would go over well on national park land. Haha.
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby MoapaPk » Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:05 pm

Buz Groshong wrote:
MoapaPk wrote:There is a great sign near Maroon Bells, shows a guy with crampons and ice tools climbing rock.

I love all the warning signs near the Grand Canyon, advising the dangers of hiking down with inadequate water, and misjudging the requirements of hiking back uphill after descending to the river. We should have lawyers at the top of the canyon, helping people sue for not getting enough warnings. That's the American way -- dumb shit behavior followed by lawsuits.


Most of those who hike into the Grand Canyon are tourons who don't hike regularly; also many are idiots. To get a permit to camp in the canyon you are sent a video warning of the dangers, those who don't know as much as experienced campers only have the signs to warn them. The warning signs would be helpful except that those who should read them don't.

Most of those who suffer dehydration in the canyon are women - they don't drink water so they won't have to pee in public. If the park wanted to actually do something about the dangers, they would install latrines along the Bright Angel Trail.


"The vast majority of people who have died in the Grand Canyon have been males, all but 6 of the 65 people reported dead from environmental factors in Myers’ and Ghiglieri’s 2001 book. Of the people they reported to have died by falling off the rim or from a cliff or steep trail, 71 were male and 17 were female.

Phillips says suicides reveal a gender divide: “I’ve been here 28 years and only two females have thrown themselves off the rim of the canyon. We see several suicides a year.”

But he’s observed – and the numbers confirm – that even the accidental deaths show a marked biological influence.

'It’s definitely younger males that take higher risks than females. It’s a proven fact,' he said. 'It has a lot to do with testosterone. Males put themselves at greater risk, attempt things that females wouldn’t normally do, whether it’s swimming in a river, climbing an exposed cliff face or just getting farther out on a promontory.'"


Actually, as of 2001, about 9 times as many people had died at the Grand from aircraft accidents, as from dehydration and heatstroke.
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby Buz Groshong » Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:42 pm

Leaves me wondering if what I heard was a myth rather than fact. On the other hand statistics on people who have to get rescued because of dehydration might no be quite the same as for those who die from dehydration.
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby mrchad9 » Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:48 pm

Unless I saw the data I wouldn't believe it. The NPS and its staff are not exactly purveyors of wisdom.

They've been telling me to take a water filter into the Sierra for years... I still haven't done it and have yet to find any reason why I should do so.
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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby Bob Sihler » Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:07 pm

Buz Groshong wrote:If the park wanted to actually do something about the dangers, they would install latrines along the Bright Angel Trail.


Hell, that trail already smells like a latrine due to the damn mules, so why not?
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Buz Groshong

Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby Bob Sihler » Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:20 pm

Buz would recognize this one; it's at Dark Hollow Falls in Shenandoah NP and cracks me up every time I see it:

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This one from Yellowstone is funny, too; they have one almost exactly like it at Badlands NP as well:

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Re: NPS vs. BLM

Postby Buz Groshong » Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:47 pm

Bob Sihler wrote:Buz would recognize this one; it's at Dark Hollow Falls in Shenandoah NP and cracks me up every time I see it:


I don't often hike the Dark Hollow Falls Trail - a bit too wimpy. :wink:

There are lots of kids on that trail and most of the parents need a more "in your face" warning than that.

Speaking of which, a woman who used to work with me told a story of hiking White Oak Canyon and seeing a kid playing over by one of the falls. She approached the parents, who were paying no attention to the child, and told them "you know it would really ruin the day for the rest of us if your child fell in and got killed." That got the parents' attention.
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