Welcome to SP!  -
Areas & RangesMountains & RocksRoutesImagesArticlesTrip ReportsGearOtherPeoplePlans & PartnersWhat's NewForum

Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me but...

Suggestions and comments about SummitPost's features, policies, and procedures. Post bugs here.
 

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby MoapaPk » Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:31 pm

Dow Williams wrote:Gangolf and company refuse to feature technical climbing objectives on the main page...it is not just his favoritism bs towards other elfs (look at current selection, not one technical climb...never is) ....


Is this really true? I've voted positively on a few Dow routes when I see them, and I generally look only on the front page (nowadays I rarely vote on anything). But I've usually added the caveat that I'm mainly voting on good presentation, because I'm not an expert in that area.

I would say Scott is a technical climber, and produces good pages, some of which end up on the front page. But as he has noted, if you put up info for obscure places, no matter how good the info is, it will probably get few votes. The Whitney trail will get more views and votes.

Folks from the media have cited Dow's info (probably not giving correct attribution), possibly because he is highly searched on google. As Dow has said, the true measure of success is where your page places on Google, rather than the SP votes.

There is some intersection in what sites cover--- e.g. I go on "true" climbing sites to get the latest info on the snow on Baboquivari, or the condition of the bolts. Even though it's mainly a hike with just 5.6 (really more like 5.2), the newest info still tends to be at climbing sites, because, well, that's what those guys do. (Climbers use the "easy" Babo route for descent, and keep up the best chatter.) Isn't that a reasonable balance? Both SP and climbing sites for different views of climbing? It works for me.

Climbers are often embarrassed to give detailed info for an 8 mile trek that has just one 20' technical pitch; but occasionally they do. There is a good description of the Castle Peaks on one climbing site, corresponding roughly to my page on SP. The difference in emphasis is interesting; I spent a bit of time on telling folks how to avoid making it much of a climb, and how best to navigate the confusing roads. The climbers mention the hardware you might use; that's not my expertise, and the actual climbing page (elsewhere) is a great complement.

A similar divide is seen in the way people describe getting up the summit block on Thunderbolt; some folks talk about lassoing the top and pulling yourself up, while others don rock shoes and do a "real" climb. Bod Burd has a neat page for the former approach.
User Avatar
MoapaPk

 
Posts: 7654
Joined: Fri May 13, 2005 7:42 pm
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada, United States
Thanked: 758 times in 491 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Fletch » Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:44 pm

Dow Williams wrote:I can only laugh...humor is the best medicine they say...Summitpost has done everything it can to shun technical climbers...Gangolf and company refuse to feature technical climbing objectives on the main page...it is not just his favoritism bs towards other elfs (look at current selection, not one technical climb...never is) .....rather there is not one elf who is a technical rock or ice climber, never has been. Gangolf or his brethren would have no idea what a classic climbing (no I mean actual climbing) addition would be to SP in any regard.

Folks who climb all the time tend not to spend much time on the internet, thus won't play the photo games...so again, never a good climbing photo gets featured on this site...if a coveted vote garner (someone who trades votes) top ropes somewhere, they might get a climbing photo through the roadside shots, but rarely....even then most current active members would have no clue the difference between top roping at a crag vs climbing an objective. And now.....canyons should appear before routes on "what is new"??? In trying to prove all the climbers who have quit this site wrong, I have hung on....now I am ready to move on as well. The site has nothing interesting to offer currently and will no doubt continue to go the nerd direction since that is who is willing to spend the time discussing any changes, with no objective insight into the varying sports that make up the word climbing. Summitpost does not need to have anything to do with climbing...Mountainproject, rockclimbing and Supertopo already exist. And Mountainproject has made the changes that count. Chris (Supertopo) is heading the right direction as well. That I concede.

Josh Lewis, Matt is impressed with you. If you (or he for that matter) want a paying contract job. I would like my beta copied and developed for google search over to Routepost.com or Gearbeans.com so I can delete it from SP.com. This offer is valid to anyone who is capable. In the end, I will need a programmer and a designer. Since these are paying gigs, I probably need to meet you first, but St. George is not a bad place to visit in the winter. I am, as always, busy climbing and don't really put myself in a position to meet folks to do this kind of work (will be in Jtree most of this week). My email is real easy to find.

Best place to get this done I figure is finding someone familiar with SP and has or can have a working relationship with Matt to make this as smooth as possible for both parties. I am looking to do this with cooperation from you Matt....want to leave in good form regarding our relationship. Always open to work with you, Josh and/or Ryle again someday. The current elf population, causing incredible stagnation to the site, is why I am leaving, not the ownership. Ryle did a great job writing this site up originally and I was really impressed that they did not monetize this thing when everyone else could or would have in the mid 2000's. They have been true to their .org status. I give them that.

Really dude? I'm not disagreeing with anything you said, but really? I thought you took the high road in little shit-fits like this. C'mon man! I'll be the first one to say it --- don't go. Please.

You seem like a heck of a good climber, you are down to earth and appear quite humble. And a lot of people on the site, myself included, respect you without ever having met you.

Do as you will, but take a breather, clear your head, whatever... before you do something big like this.
User Avatar
Fletch

 
Posts: 232
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2012 5:46 pm
Location: Orange County
Thanked: 90 times in 49 posts

The following user would like to thank Fletch for this post
MoapaPk, mrchad9

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby mrchad9 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:54 pm

I, for one, think it would be more constructive for this site if major contributors like Dow had more input into how the site was being run.
User Avatar
mrchad9

 
Posts: 4210
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:01 am
Location: San Ramon, California, United States
Thanked: 1216 times in 825 posts

The following user would like to thank mrchad9 for this post
Fletch

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Scott » Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:10 pm

I would say Scott is a technical climber, and produces good pages, some of which end up on the front page. But as he has noted, if you put up info for obscure places, no matter how good the info is, it will probably get few votes. The Whitney trail will get more views and votes.


I don't know if Dow would consider me to be a technical climber, but it seems to me that most of the route and mountain/rock pages that I have had featured on the front page happened right after someone (someone else or me) added a detailed trip report to the page. I don’t know who picks the front page routes and/or mountain/rocks (I have never nominated any pages, my own or others), but I’m just guessing that at least some of them are picked because rather than read every page on SP, whoever does it sees what good trip reports were added lately and often picks whatever routes/mountains they were applicable to (if they appear to be of high quality).

It’s not always the case, but it seemed to be the case on several occasions.

Summitpost has done everything it can to shun technical climbers


In the old days of Summitpost, technical climbing routes were considered taboo, unless they reached the summit of a "real mountain". Cragging or wall pages were discouraged by many purist.
User Avatar
Scott

 
Posts: 7505
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:03 pm
Location: Craig, Colorado, United States
Thanked: 649 times in 346 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Dow Williams » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:01 pm

Chad, Fletch, thanks for the kind words, but I am by no means quitting. Rather I am going to invest in a site that is much more dynamic or join Chris at Supertopo or some other hybrid alternative. I have held my tongue way to long on this crap while watching other climbers leave. Great folks too. I always thought I could change the culture by hanging in here and setting an example, challenge the status quo and they would come back. Not going to happen. The mass exodus is already over.

This fiefdom that Gangolf and others play has just gotten way too old for me and Matt simply does not have time to challenge it or even understand it. I thought Bob Shiler would...seemed like a pretty cool cat to me....but in the end, he was not willing to stand up and challenge this good ole boy relationship either. I want to belong to something dynamic...not hang out at some coffee shop with a bunch of old farts. This site has gotten so stale....and I can see just from the conversations between Burd and Matt about the stupid voting issue (this is what we should be spending all of Matt's new found energy on, really????)...that Matt has no idea what I am talking about in terms of challenging this site to be more dynamic and diverse.....apparently he just is to busy to even have any insight to what is going on at SP..... attract new blood...attract diversity.....just not set up to do it and at this point I now see it never will be.

Scott. I (and others) have climbed many hard technical routes leading to summits, including 20+ pitches of 5.10-11, to summits. Bugaboos, Zion, a variety of hefty north faces, along with some other pretty classic shit in N. America. It is here, just you would not know it. This has nothing to do with the fact I add a lot of walls and ice vs mountains during the winter months if that is what you are alluding to. In the summer I am all over big mountain routes, so have others in the past....I admit, those contributions are far and few between now......this has everything to do with these same old elves with their petty grudges having no interest in promoting the future of SP...it is just a storage site to constantly feature their own boring crap. Stagnant is the word and has been for way, way too long.
User Avatar
Dow Williams

 
Posts: 2349
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 1:59 pm
Location: Utah and Canadian Rockies
Thanked: 219 times in 101 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby mrchad9 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:11 pm

Dow Williams wrote:Stagnant is the word and has been for way, way too long.

I agree. Becoming more dynamic should be the priority above all else. I confess that I believe some changes to the voting system would be an asset in helping future contributions, but don't think it should take priority over making the site more energetic (and I don't think simply changing the look and feel by adding new colors or banners qualifies as an improvement at all).

Just looking at the home page just now... there are 18 total photos on it... only ONE of someone in the process of climbing something. That's bad enough... but what is worse is that 13 of the 18 have or will be there for a week or more, and 80% of the others are just profile thumbnails.
User Avatar
mrchad9

 
Posts: 4210
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:01 am
Location: San Ramon, California, United States
Thanked: 1216 times in 825 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Scott » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:23 pm

Scott. I (and others) have climbed many hard technical routes leading to summits, including 20+ pitches of 5.10-11, to summits. Bugaboos, Zion, a variety of hefty north faces, along with some other pretty classic shit in N. America.


Actually, I already know and have already read much of your pages (and seen many, many of your photographs).

This has nothing to do with the fact I add a lot of walls and ice vs mountains during the winter months if that is what you are alluding to.


No, that isn't what I am alluding to. I just was pointing out that disagreements on technical submissions (or lack there of) are nothing new and existed even when SP was newer, though some of the debates were different, (and that SP was never geared to only technical stuff, though the arguments existed that it should be). In fact, in the "old days" it was even less geared to technical stuff because cragging, waterfall ice, submissions on walls, etc. were sometimes discouraged. To me, it seems more geared towards technical stuff than it used to be.

I wasn't saying that you only did cragging/waterfall ice at all. Those arguments (cragging/waterfall ice) existed at one time, but are no longer debated as they were back then. However, it is good to point out that, the same points you are making in the above posts are actually some of the same arguments (about "getting stale", "stagnant", "keeping it real", "not hardcore enough", etc.) that existed even back in 2003. I'm not arguing with any of your points, but can say that many of them have existed a long time, even when SP was new. I don't think SP will ever be geared to only featuring hard core climbs or routes, at least it never has been since I've been here. The only way to increase the content or percentage of those is by adding them (which you have been doing). I don't know if SP ever was "hardcore". In fact, in some periods of time in the past, it seems even less so (at least as far as technical stuff goes). When I first started here used to be not that many technical mountains/routes at all, except for the mountain pages on the well known big peaks (Matterhorn, Eiger, K2, etc.), and now there are many (although there are also many, many more non-technical mountains/routes as well).
Last edited by Scott on Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:48 pm, edited 7 times in total.
User Avatar
Scott

 
Posts: 7505
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:03 pm
Location: Craig, Colorado, United States
Thanked: 649 times in 346 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby MoapaPk » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:26 pm

Scott wrote:I don't know if Dow would consider me to be a technical climber,


I am naive about the naming; but you use technical methods to achieve summits. I remember your descriptions of retrievable anchors -- down-to-earth discussions of physics and all-- they were well beyond what a scrambler, hiker, or peak-bagger (even most canyoneers) would know.

but it seems to me that most of the route and mountain/rock pages that I have had featured on the front page happened right after someone (someone else or me) added a detailed trip report to the page.


I guess that makes sense, in a good way. People like the details and up-to-date info from trip reports.
User Avatar
MoapaPk

 
Posts: 7654
Joined: Fri May 13, 2005 7:42 pm
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada, United States
Thanked: 758 times in 491 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Scott » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:30 pm

I don't know if Dow would consider me to be a technical climber,

I am naive about the naming; but you use technical methods to achieve summits. I remember your descriptions of retrievable anchors -- down-to-earth discussions of physics and all-- they were well beyond what a scrambler, hiker, or peak-bagger (even most canyoneers) would know.


Yes, some people would consider me to be a technical climber. I'm not sure that I'm the type of technical climber that Dow is referring to though (in a different league than what I do) . I guess that's a different topic though.
User Avatar
Scott

 
Posts: 7505
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:03 pm
Location: Craig, Colorado, United States
Thanked: 649 times in 346 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Bubba Suess » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:57 pm

Dow, if you want to go then that is your prerogative. However, you have obviously invested a lot into Summitpost. Rather than just up and leave, see how the changes go. Maybe it will improve and be more to your liking. If it is not, then safe climbing! Change is obviously afoot though, and you ought to invest just a little more effort to effect change here rather than expend substantial effort or finances to move your contributions elsewhere.
User Avatar
Bubba Suess

 
Posts: 697
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 9:15 pm
Location: Mount Shasta, California, United States
Thanked: 174 times in 97 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Montana Matt » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:58 pm

I am really sorry to hear you feel as you do Dow.
MoapaPk wrote:Folks from the media have cited Dow's info (probably not giving correct attribution), possibly because he is highly searched on google. As Dow has said, the true measure of success is where your page places on Google, rather than the SP votes.

I can almost guarantee if you move your content from SP, and I would be saddened to see that happen, that it will garner far fewer views than it will here on SP. SP is an old site, which counts hugely to the SEs. And it is very well SEO'd now (happened a couple of years ago and that's why the site traffic has increased so much in the same time frame). I think it would be a shame to move your stuff somewhere else where it will be viewed nowhere near as much as it is here. After all, you're writing your content/beta so that it is shared with the climbing community at large. It would be a crying shame to hide it away on some rarely-visited website.
Dow Williams wrote:that Matt has no idea what I am talking about in terms of challenging this site to be more dynamic and diverse.....apparently he just is to busy to even have any insight to what is going on at SP..... attract new blood...attract diversity.....just not set up to do it and at this point I now see it never will be.

While I am skilled at certain things, one of them is definitely not being creative or ingenious. I work best when given concrete directives. I hear phrases like "SummitPost needs to be more diverse and dynamic" and I agree, but I don't honestly know how to accomplish that. I thrive on specifics...I'm not a visionary.

I also have a bit of "tunnel vision" at times and tend to hyper-focus on whatever task I'm working on. This allows me to get things done quickly, but at the cost of ignoring a lot of other things. At the moment, I'm working on the voting system. When I asked the elves, who I rely on heavily for reporting to me what the site is in need of, fixing the voting system was at the top of the list. And I've read the same request posted numerous times elsewhere on the forums by other users and have been sent PMs about it as well. So I think a change to that was definitely warranted. The changes to the voting system may not be as substantial as I initially thought they would be, especially if we end up going with the system that Chad did a great job working up last night. Initially I thought it would probably take a week or more to make the changes to the database and code to implement a change to the voting system. But if all that has to change is the way the score is calculated, that should only be a day or two. Once that's done, I can move onto something else.

I plan to work on SP as much as I can over the next 3 months, so please bear with us at least through that time and I'll see what I can do to make the site dynamic and attractive to new users.

If you could give me specific examples of what you'd like to see done to accomplish more diversity and to make the site more dynamic, that would be extremely helpful to me. You've hinted multiple times at seeing a change to the front page. If you could give me an outline of what exactly you'd like to see changed, I can certainly consider it. Something like a sketch or a mockup or concrete ideas for the changing of the front page would be invaluable to getting the process started. We could make content selection for the front page more random and somewhat automated if that would be agreeable to the SP user base at large. The reason articles and trip reports are chosen manually at this time is primarily due to the fact that a snippet of text must be selected and automating this isn't really feasible because it could end up incoherent.

However, the Featured Pages on the right side bar and the POTX images could be randomized to some degree, based on score and a random element. Let me know if you have concrete ideas of what you'd like to see changed Dow and I promise I will listen very intently.
User Avatar
Montana Matt
Site Admin
 
Posts: 1148
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2004 10:06 pm
Location: Ashland, Oregon, United States
Thanked: 347 times in 187 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby mrchad9 » Mon Jan 14, 2013 9:33 pm

Montana Matt wrote:Initially I thought it would probably take a week or more to make the changes to the database and code to implement a change to the voting system. But if all that has to change is the way the score is calculated, that should only be a day or two. Once that's done, I can move onto something else.

That is great to hear! I had hoped, and anticipated, that it might not be too prohibitive. I truely do think all that is needed is a change to the calculation formula, not a change to the voting process itself. Perhaps this will end up an even easier change than like/dislike system (which requires an interface change).

Note that if we change the range of page scores, I think at some point it may be worth changing how the power points are calculated for the page owners. Currently (according to the faqs) this is an exponential function for high scoring pages. If we modified this (and even simpler basic formula change) perhaps the concern over high profile pages and their scores would be mitigated. I have some ideas here two but didn't want to pile on unitl you were ready. It's much simpler than the page score calculation. (Also I think less important... since it is more invisible to the users... but the impacts will be seen when folks see their profile pages).

Montana Matt wrote:However, the Featured Pages on the right side bar and the POTX images could be randomized to some degree, based on score and a random element. Let me know if you have concrete ideas of what you'd like to see changed Dow and I promise I will listen very intently.

High level thoughts I have include making at least one third of the featured articles, TRs, and pages change daily. The daily change could be to a randomly selected previously featured page (there are TONS in the database by now, that most users have never had the chance to notice). I would change featured pages more frequently in general. Perhaps instead of having them up there for two weeks at a time, have them for 2 days at a time for 25% of the time over a 1 month period (automatically popping in and back out along with other manually selected pages).

I would also change the layout, to put rapidly changing things at the top (like new members and featured photos) and stale stuff at the bottom (like the 'New to SP' links). We all want new members to see those links, but I don't think we are getting the full value of the home page asset with the links where they are.
User Avatar
mrchad9

 
Posts: 4210
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:01 am
Location: San Ramon, California, United States
Thanked: 1216 times in 825 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Dow Williams » Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:34 pm

Thanks Matt. For one, putting Chad in charge of the front page selection process would be huge for summitpost in my opinion, I mean the entire front page. That is bringing in new blood, that is making a big change. Here is an individual willing to randomize the selection process to no selfish interest of his own. That is not the way your volunteer site operators do it now, particulary Gangolf. Maybe adding Liba and another "technical climber" or two to the elf population whilst at the same time asking some of these old white men who have being doing it for 10 years+ to step down. Think youth, think women (horrible representation here compared to MP), even think race. Think diversity.

Matt, my interest in moving on far exceeds trying to compete with SP. Like I said, as far as you, Josh and Ryle are concerned, if anything, I would rather keep a working relationship. However, I refuse to have Gangolf and others continue to run a site into the ground I have so much vested in, whilst promoting their own obscure, work. I put too much effort into it. I have brought other fresh faces like Liba on board only to see them leave eventually because it is so stale and boring.

If Scott and others think folks attracted to the site have more use for German hikes over Red Rock trad climbing (I have yet ever to print a page for a hike, I have printed tons from the internet for beta on climbs), then that is the site you will be, like I said, you sure do not need to be a climbing site.

Josh emailed me, so I might as well get it out there....somebody who is passionate about this stuff might exist here....losing my Google ranking at first does not bother me Matt....folks who need and use my beta will find it again.......over time, it will sort back to the top. I am willing to spend the money to do it right and get it back to the top as well. Unlike you, outdoor adventure is my full time business. I thought it easier that I climb, write and post and you take care of the rest, but that has not happened, the site has gone south instead. This is going to take me forever I am sure...so I am not going any where overnight, will definitely pay attention to your changes. Sorry I have never gotten specific enough for you, I don't speak programmers language. The stuff I notice is glaring to anyone who contributes. I realize from your vantage point, you simply don't see it.

Josh asked me some questions, this is what I wrote to him....

"I want to pay someone, and trust me, I realize this is not a one person job in terms of qualifications, to manage the copy and set up of my data as close to what it looks like now, although of course I am open to whatever design somebody wants to get creative with, to gearbeans.com. It is my intent to eventually make this a retail site where algorithms are set up to reward buyers with store credit for their beta contributions. Been proposing it for ten years....was a huge deal back then. Ten years ago, I had sit downs with the CEO of REI, one of the founders of Backcountry.com (before they sold out to Liberty) and the 2nd man over at Sierra Trading Post. It was a $250K project.

I have climbing partners/friends who work both at SAP and Google. I understand the complexities with which I am dealing. I also understand that they have softened a ton in ten years. Still, it is no easy or cheap venture. But if I never get started, it will never come to fruition. I have the funds, but what I need first is to secure my own beta and make sure it is set up to rank in Google, whatever costs that involve. From there, we can proceed. You are young and appear to be ambitious. Maybe you have interest. Bottom line, I am willing to pay someone to set up a whole new site that performs the same function as SP at this current time, allowing my beta to always be accessed and ranked from true searches."

I need to move forward with this Matt. I doubt highly you really want to shake up your volunteer site administrators, even though in my opinion, they are as responsible for the stagnated condition of the site today as you owners are. The site needs new blood and I just don't see you willing to do that. We might as well work hand in hand. I do trust you, Josh and Ryle, no worries. I am going to keep adding beta as I always have. I just need to get this moved over to something much more dynamite, with partnering websites or on my own. Been talking about it way to long.
User Avatar
Dow Williams

 
Posts: 2349
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 1:59 pm
Location: Utah and Canadian Rockies
Thanked: 219 times in 101 posts

The following user would like to thank Dow Williams for this post
mrchad9

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Montana Matt » Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:42 pm

mrchad9 wrote:That is great to hear! I had hoped, and anticipated, that it might not be too prohibitive. I truely do think all that is needed is a change to the calculation formula, not a change to the voting process itself. Perhaps this will end up an even easier change than like/dislike system (which requires an interface change).

Right. Going to that system would be quite a bit of work. With the equation you worked up, I am already running a script on the development server that is recalculating page scores with the new code. It seems to be working pretty well.
mrchad9 wrote:Note that if we change the range of page scores, I think at some point it may be worth changing how the power points are calculated for the page owners.

That may certainly need to be addressed. Once the script is complete and all page scores are updated, I'm going to run the script to update all users' power levels and see what they are. If they're reasonable, perhaps no change will be necessary. If not, I may need your help again coming up with something that will work for that calculation as well.
mrchad9 wrote:High level thoughts I have include making at least one third of the featured articles, TRs, and pages change daily.

That's challenging if we want to include any text on the front page along with the article or TR. Automating the selection of that text isn't an easy task and could result with uninteresting text or partial sentences on the front page.
mrchad9 wrote:The daily change could be to a randomly selected previously featured page (there are TONS in the database by now, that most users have never had the chance to notice).

Oh, that's a great idea. Yeah, that would be easy to do because the selected text and image are already saved in the database.
mrchad9 wrote:Perhaps instead of having them up there for two weeks at a time, have them for 2 days at a time for 25% of the time over a 1 month period (automatically popping in and back out along with other manually selected pages).

Sure, whatever people think is reasonable in terms of time for a page to stay featured.
mrchad9 wrote:I would also change the layout, to put rapidly changing things at the top (like new members and featured photos) and stale stuff at the bottom (like the 'New to SP' links). We all want new members to see those links, but I don't think we are getting the full value of the home page asset with the links where they are.

Hmm, yeah...I'm sure that most members would probably agree with that. Again, reorganization of the front page is fairly easy to do. I would just need someone to tell me or give me a mock up of the changes needing to be implemented.
User Avatar
Montana Matt
Site Admin
 
Posts: 1148
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2004 10:06 pm
Location: Ashland, Oregon, United States
Thanked: 347 times in 187 posts

Re: Totally insignificant and probably matters only to me bu

Postby Dow Williams » Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:27 pm

Chad, making a database of pages only already featured, or making that a minimum requirement, would be a fail in my opinion. Gangolf has never been objective in his selections. That would move from boring selections to randomly boring selections. There are so many gems that he ignores either because he does not understand them (technical submissions) or the submitters are not part of the old guard. Rather select some minimum requirement score...maybe five 10-10 votes (and of course whatever that would equate to in the new voting system)... same with photos....lower the bar considerably. Folks without friends here have made great submissions....if five others have noticed it and gave it a thumbs up (whatever that equates to in the new voting arrangement), it should be worthy of flowing through the random stream. Same with photos. Lowering the bar is the only way to eliminate the games and avatars. Dilute manipulators ability to bore us to death with the same stuff. Making it change frequently will allow many good pages to get noticed. The page should look different every time someone refreshes it, if that can be done within budgetary constraints for Matt.
User Avatar
Dow Williams

 
Posts: 2349
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 1:59 pm
Location: Utah and Canadian Rockies
Thanked: 219 times in 101 posts

PreviousNext

Return to Site Feedback

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

© 2006-2013 SummitPost.org. All Rights Reserved.