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SP truly is dead...

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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby Puma concolor » Sat Dec 31, 2016 4:05 pm

SP is NOT dead!

As measured by internet hits on existing pages, the data clearly shows that the strategy has changed. The focus is now primarily geared towards visitors to the site who find the pages through google and other search engines. This means greater advertiser interest. No longer are the owners concerned with attracting new members and forum traffic. All the major mountains and ranges are in here. Members are mostly a nuisance and relic of the past.

Instead, SP is trying to generate views of mostly outdated, unmaintained, marginal pages in an effort to assist folks in their efforts to get lost in the mountains.

Happy New Year! :D
“What a waste it is to lose one's mind, or not to have a mind is being very wasteful, how true that is.” - Dan Quayle
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby lcarreau » Sat Dec 31, 2016 5:22 pm

Mostly agree, but what's wrong with getting LOST in the mountains ? After all, the writing's on the Wall :!:

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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby Scott » Sun Jan 01, 2017 3:04 am

The "demise" of summitpost is 100% the fault of the goddamned lazy-ass Summitpost Elves.


Our apologies. The elves have been busy doing non-SP stuff lately:

Bob:

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Gangolf:

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Josh:

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Scott:

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Matt:

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(We won't say who this one is):

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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby Diesel » Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:57 am

If you guys don't like it, why do you bother posting here? There are so many other climbing sites, it's hard to believe you are wasting your precious time on this site. Let us losers post here without your condescending comments. We are just fine without your amazing adventures. Just be jerks somewhere else.
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby Marmaduke » Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:50 am

Diesel wrote:If you guys don't like it, why do you bother posting here? There are so many other climbing sites, it's hard to believe you are wasting your precious time on this site. Let us losers post here without your condescending comments. We are just fine without your amazing adventures. Just be jerks somewhere else.


Guess I enjoy the abuse?
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby Scott » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:22 am

On a serious note:

No longer are the owners concerned with attracting new members and forum traffic.


It seems no one has heard from the owners for almost 11 years now. One owner logged in once last year and the other hasn't logged in since 2011. Still, neither has said anything since early 2006. There is one paid administrator that keeps the site limping along.

All the major mountains and ranges are in here.


This is very true and a real issue. Most well known mountains already have pages. It's harder for new members to contribute pages since the well known mountains are mostly taken. In the US, states such as Alaska are ripe for the picking, but there aren't too many members up there.

It is harder for new members to contribute. Having a new member reach the front page of the People page is unlikely, so it will be the same old folk that have prominent pages. Newer members are sorely needed. The People page is basically stagnant and stale.

Instead, SP is trying to generate views of mostly outdated, unmaintained, marginal pages in an effort to assist folks in their efforts to get lost in the mountains.


I don't know if most pages are outdated, but a lot of them are. This is where the future lies with SP. Now that most of the famous mountains have been added, page adoption is what is needed. This can be done by new and fresh members.

I wonder what the best way to encourage new members to adopt pages might be? Maybe we need to find a way to flag out of date pages as adoptable?
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby spiderman » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:31 am

Wow, I didn't know that the owners are AWOL. SP is one of my favorite places for climbing information. Most of the pages are well edited with accurate route descriptions. I almost never go to the forum, but that is not a big deal to me. Perhaps someone needs to give the owners a good buy-out option since there is so much value in this site and community.
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby lcarreau » Fri Jan 06, 2017 3:30 am

Very well said, Spider-Man ^^^^ ...

"Spiderman, Spiderman,
Does whatever a spider can!

Spins a web, any size,
Catches thieves just like flies;
Look Out!

Here comes Spider Man.

(Screw those creepy Venus Fly Traps, we got SPIDERMAN) :!:
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby Bubba Suess » Sat Jan 07, 2017 2:13 am

Scott wrote:On a serious note:

It is harder for new members to contribute. Having a new member reach the front page of the People page is unlikely, so it will be the same old folk that have prominent pages. Newer members are sorely needed. The People page is basically stagnant and stale.

Instead, SP is trying to generate views of mostly outdated, unmaintained, marginal pages in an effort to assist folks in their efforts to get lost in the mountains.


I don't know if most pages are outdated, but a lot of them are. This is where the future lies with SP. Now that most of the famous mountains have been added, page adoption is what is needed. This can be done by new and fresh members.

I wonder what the best way to encourage new members to adopt pages might be? Maybe we need to find a way to flag out of date pages as adoptable?


I agree with you Scott. One of the reasons I went inactive on SP 4 years ago was because of more senior members than myself clinging to pages they hadn't touched in 8 or 9 or whatever years. They were obstacles to my trying to build a really comprehensive set of pages for my area. I tired of it and decided to go do my own thing, which has turned out pretty well, considering what followed. Now I recognize that I am the senior member who is clinging to pages that I haven't touched in years. I hardly check into SP anymore (in part because of the camaraderie that used to be here dissipating) and I have no plans to work on my pages. I have lately been considering putting them up for adoption, if I could ensure that the people who took them over would treat them well. I am not sure how to go about that. I don't want to put them up and then see them diminished.

Your idea of flagging pages for adoption pages owned by inactive users or pages that have not been upgraded for years is a good and necessary thing. I don't think pages should just be taken away, but if the owners are unwilling to put the work into updating them, then they should go to those who are willing to do it.
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby Scott » Sat Jan 07, 2017 2:54 am

I am not sure how to go about that. I don't want to put them up and then see them diminished.


One way would be go to "Change Privileges" on the page and to make the "Orphanage" the page owner. Then people will know that they are for adoption. If you left yourself as administrator, you could always take them back if you change your mind.

http://www.summitpost.org/users/orphanage/66446

Unfortunately, a lot of people don't know of the orphanage page, so it would be better if there was something more visible.
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby surgent » Sat Jan 07, 2017 10:51 pm

The attraction of SP is that pages are created and owned by individuals and reflect individual styles, ranging from very good to lousy. Should the site go to a wiki style, then pages would eventually become all alike in some general sense, and that assumes that the pages are not abused by people deliberately out to subterfuge the work of others, or people who just have no clue what they're doing. So.... is there a middle ground? Can someone not active for 2 years have their pages made available to anyone? Can pages not updated in 5 years (regardless if their owner is active or not) be made available? Much of this is easy coding and could be reviewed by site admins or elves of certain status.

I 100% agree that new blood is needed. The site has grown stale. When I first started in 2003, it was exciting to be posting pages because there were so many peaks without pages. Now I have something like 120 peak pages, an have deliberately slowed down my new pages over the last few years. I have given up a few and am willing to give up a few more, too. Here's a crazy idea: send out word to everyone to willingly give up pages they may no longer want to keep. We may get quite a few willing to do so, and some new people can take over.

SP still is unique --- no other site quite matches it. Peakery uses boilerplate templates for its pages, Peakbagger and LoJ are more for logging climbs rather than narratives, and other sites tend to be highly localized to one area, rather than truly worldwide as SP. It needs an owner who is active and passionate about the page, and some tweaks to allow stale pages to be put up for adoption, new people to get more active, and some slight shift toward wiki editing yet still allowing page owners to govern "their" pages.

I still check in regularly, not as much as I used to, but I still think the whole site and the concept are sound. But there are always new pages, lots from Europe and England and North America and some from Asia. I'd like to see more Mexican peak pages. There are dozens of quality peaks in Arizona without pages. Not "all" mountains have pages, and many good ones are still ripe for the picking. People just have to stop looking at climbing the two or three most famous peaks in their area, and go climb some off-the-beaten-path peaks. The site isn't dead. Just needs a little kick to the behind.
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby lcarreau » Sun Jan 08, 2017 12:29 am

surgent wrote: The site isn't dead. Just needs a little kick to the behind.


A VERY swift kick to the behind, whether the guy in front of you has hemorrhoids or not !!! -- :D
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Re: SP truly is dead...

Postby Scott » Sun Jan 08, 2017 5:44 am

and that assumes that the pages are not abused by people deliberately out to subterfuge the work of others


That's the trick. Saboteur/hackers have already gotten through security several times and deleted all the pages that they can. Luckily they were recovered (except for photos) and many new security measures are now in place, but if SP ever went wiki, vandalism would be rampant.

Adoption is the best solution, in my opinion.
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