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These guys have been really busy stealing photos from SP

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Postby Ropeboy » Wed Oct 29, 2008 2:34 pm

The same subject of stolen photos has been discussed at length on photography forums.
The discussions all boil down to this:
1. Great shots will continue to be stolen off the web and used and by others and you will be helpless to stop it.
2. If you don't want it stolen, don't post it on the internet. Period.
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Postby Corax » Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:02 pm

Ropeboy wrote:1. Great shots will continue to be stolen off the web and used and by others and you will be helpless to stop it.


Helpless to stop it, yes, but not to act against it.

The way some people look at this phenomena strike me as odd.
If you own any kind of property and someone steal it from you, do you just let it happen?
Don't you try to get it back or get compensation for what's stolen?
A lot of people think you're helpless and that there are no weapons against the thieves, "just because it's an internet thing and you just have to accept it as it is".
You're wrong.
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Postby MoapaPk » Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:25 pm

I feel for you Corax, really I do, but consider:

If you own a valuable item, do you leave it in front of your house on the curb at night?

I've recently had some text for a trip description completely plagiarized. I e-mailed the organizer for the group; no response. I finally contacted the actual poster and he was quite embarrassed and reworded the text.

This is the new norm of the web. Apart from putting the words "copyrighted by..." on the photo, I'm not sure what preventative measures can be taken. In some of my items I've actually hidden my initials in an inconspicuous corner. But you may not have much luck presenting such evidence to a court in Pakistan.
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Postby nartreb » Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:33 pm

It's amazing how often, when somebody says, "I'm doing X", a bunch of other people chime in to say "it'll never work". This despite the fact that the first person is actually *doing* it.


Not sure if the naysayers posting here don't have the common courtesy to read the whole thread before posting, of if they're just incapable of absorbing new information.
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Postby Corax » Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:52 pm

MoapaPk wrote:If you own a valuable item, do you leave it in front of your house on the curb at night?


I'm not sure if that comparison is valid.
If I did and the item just disappeared, my only hope would be the police or someone else finds it for me.
If the item was seen by me or someone else somewhere, the case would be a matter of getting it back.
Internet image theft is mostly like the latter example, as the images many times are easily found or seen by someone else which reports it to the owner.
Of course, many of my images may have been stolen without my knowledge, but that's not something I think about.
Further, I don't think it's like leaving something valuable outside your house at night.
First, if you leave things in that way, the insurance companies would not cover your loss and the police would tell you you're an idiot and don't follow up the case very well or not at all.
On the other hand, if you post a photo on a site which is encompassed by the copyright laws, you have legal rights and help to find from organizations, copyright violation lawyers and also the police.
A domain host which get a call from the police telling them that they are hosting stolen material, will very quickly close that account if the alternative is the police will start an investigation and possibly close down the whole domain while the investigation is going on.

I do agree it's difficult to fight a case if the photos end up in a distant part of the world, but usually most of these cases can be settled with a single email asking them to remove or pay.
Peakware and OEAV seems to be two splendid examples of those which don't care.

Nartreb: :D
Very well said.
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Postby MoapaPk » Wed Oct 29, 2008 4:41 pm

nartreb wrote:It's amazing how often, when somebody says, "I'm doing X", a bunch of other people chime in to say "it'll never work". This despite the fact that the first person is actually *doing* it.


Not sure if the naysayers posting here don't have the common courtesy to read the whole thread before posting, of if they're just incapable of absorbing new information.


I've followed this thread for some time, and have been gladdened to see the many posted links that are now broken, indicating success. However, I'm disturbed that there seems to be little discussion of a proactive measure to prevent the theft in the first place, and it seems there is a considerable amount of effort to get folks to remove pictures willingly.

It is usually possible to settle matters with an e-mail. In many cases, though, you will be ignored, and the costs of following the trail, and prosecution, will all be on your side and will become annoyingly high.
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Postby nartreb » Wed Oct 29, 2008 4:59 pm

>the costs of following the trail, and prosecution, will all be on your side

Simply not true - in most countries (even the US which for most other kinds of lawsuits follows the "American rule") legal costs will be paid by the violator, if it comes to a court case. That makes it quite easy to find a lawyer who'll take the case on contingency - in other words for no out-of-pocket costs at all. That's for civil prosecutions; in most countries copyright violations are also a criminal matter. If the police become involved they usually bear their own costs.
But usually no court case is necessary - if an email to the website author doesn't do the trick, a formal letter to the website's hosting provider (a "trail" that takes about two minutes to follow) usually does. Costs of this: practically zero.
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Postby Diego Sahagún » Wed Oct 29, 2008 5:17 pm

sjarelkwint wrote:http://2morocco.blogspot.com/2008/07/climbing-jbel-toubkal-in-morocco.html

steeling pictures of SP


The pic of Jbel Toubkal from Timesguida n'Ounanoukrim and almost the whole text about the mountain are mine :shock:
Last edited by Diego Sahagún on Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby MoapaPk » Wed Oct 29, 2008 5:24 pm

nartreb wrote:>the costs of following the trail, and prosecution, will all be on your side

Simply not true - in most countries.


I guess I think of the "cost" as mainly including your aggravation, because I rarely see any product worth spending more than $0.02 on. In my recent case, it took some effort to get in touch with the site owner (I had to subscribe to the site first), and he never answered repeated e-mails. I'm sure it's easy in principle, and I'm always glad to hear success stories, but not everybody has pleasant experiences. Some lawyers revel in aggravation; I don't. And, as stated before, a lot of problems seem to come from countires that don't have the same viewpoint.
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Postby Diego Sahagún » Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:46 pm

Diego Sahagún wrote:
sjarelkwint wrote:http://2morocco.blogspot.com/2008/07/climbing-jbel-toubkal-in-morocco.html

steeling pictures of SP


The pic of Jbel Toubkal from Timesguida n'Ounanoukrim and almost the whole text about the mountain are mine :shock:


How I could contact with my forger :?:
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Postby nartreb » Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:44 am

Diego, you could try leaving a comment on that site. Given the "quality" of the other content on that site, I'm not optimistic, but it's worth a try.

If you don't get quick results, drop a line to Google, who hosts that site.

Specific directions here
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Postby Diego Sahagún » Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:06 am

I've found its e-mail address using a search engine. I can't post a comment in the blog because it should be enabled by the blogger. Anyway, thanks for the site. It could be useful.

The rat could be still in SP but I haven't found it yet
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Postby nartreb » Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:11 pm

On October 30, Asmaa said...
Dear DIEGO SAHAGUN PAREJA, we have deleted the text , and we are sorry about that.


(They deleted the photos too.)
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Postby Diego Sahagún » Thu Oct 30, 2008 4:23 pm

:D
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