SummitPost.org

It is not here about SP language (why asking ? It's in the FAQ) but about (excellent) spelling.

One part of my original question should be as follows: when should we "translate in English" places names and when not.
The question might sound absurd, but in some languages (slavic between others) we declinate surnames (then place names), something unimaginable in other languages where surnames are sacred and unmodifiable (tennis player Caroline Wozniacki, not Wozniacka, is an example).
Which perhaps explains the tendancy some countries to systematically translate all places names that can be translated. Making unclear the barrier between what one would call "etymology of a place name" and "excellent English".
One example: should Hajducka vrata be Rebel's door ?

This whole thread seems to be a whole lot of fuss about nothing. The precedent was set years ago.

It’s quite simple, if a mountain has commonly used native and English (or whatever) names, call the page both, for example:

Mount McKinley (Denali)

or

Matterhorn - Monte Cervino

or

Snowdon/Yr Wyddfa


If it doesn’t, just give it its native name and use all the special characters you want.

...also don't just translate the name into English for no other reason than this is an English language site. If it's not known by an English name, then there's no need to give it one.

…and use your own initiative as to what’s a commonly used name, nobody wants to see titles turn into paragraphs.

Simple.

Nanuls wrote:Simple.

Nanuls, to make a better example, what would you say if for example a page about Buachaille Etive Mòr was titled "Great herdsman of Etive" ?
Sure that's correct English, but what about the ethic of places names I am trying to raise here ?

borutb wrote:

yatsek wrote:1.1 What language should I use for my submissions?

We prefer all submissions to be in English, including reports, logs, comments, and photo captions.

Excellent spelling and grammar are strongly encouraged.

Excellent yatsek!
Why wouldn't you post this re-statement in the General Forum?

Because British/American culture includes answering a particular question instead of ignoring it or making a mess by producing meaningless talk. And the headline of this thread reads, “How should (European) peak names be spelled?”

It's never been me who feels unhappy because other SP members spell toponyms differently. To my mind, if someone feels uncomfortable with the English language and culture, why don't they look for fulfillment and happiness on a non-English site? (And I'm not referring to those who choose not to speak on the forum.)

visentin wrote:

Nanuls wrote:Simple.

Nanuls, to make a better example, what would you say if for example a page about Buachaille Etive Mòr was titled "Great herdsman of Etive" ?
Sure that's correct English, but what about the ethic of places names I am trying to raise here ?

Come on Eric, use some common sense, no one calls Buachaille Etive Mòr the Great herdsman of Etive.

I wrote the following in my above post, it applies here.

...also don't just translate the name into English for no other reason than this is an English language site. If it's not known by an English name, then there's no need to give it one.

Cheers
Dan

...also don't just translate the name into English for no other reason than this is an English language site. If it's not known by an English name, then there's no need to give it one.

That's exactly what I wanted to summarize. Of course Scottish names were only an example, but there are other parts of Europe where in my opinion original names are excessively translated.
Talking abotu English/American culture and stuff in my opinion derives from the topic and cannot justify inventing names. Sorry if one particular person feels referred, but it's not the target of this thread. It only inspired me discussing this issue and there are far many more cases I saw on this site.

Fletch wrote:Unfortunately, European languages are dying (birthrates <2.1 means there are less and less people who speak French, German, Italian, etc everyday). In 100 years the whole world will speak English, Chinese, Arabic, and Spanish... It's unfortunate, but it's the truth...

1. I'm not sure you got the concept of birth rates right.
2. There are more languages in the world than the ones spoken in North America, Europe, the Middle East, and China.
3. Carry on...

visentin wrote:…other parts of Europe where in my opinion original names are excessively translated.(…)inventing names(…) far many more cases I saw on this site.

Here, as of 5th post and here

Someone’s been seeing things, I’ve said that before.

visentin wrote: Sorry if one particular person feels referred, but it's not the target of this thread. It only inspired me…

I suppose so.

Yes and no.
"Iser mountains", even if "correct" (ok, the Germans call it Isergebirge) is not used anywhere.
I'll leave it in the page's text, along with explaining its origin, but change only the title of the area page.
You're not the one who mispells the most places, far from that. Just look at the High Tatras area and count the number of Slovak peaks spelled in Polish...

I see.

This is a good example.

Any more?

As stated above - it's not a question of the language articles are posted in. It's English and nobody is arguing that it should be anything else. It's about diacritics that are not always intelligible for English speakers and non-latin alphabets that require some kind of transcription/translitaration.
I think that the original versions of toponyms should be used in the texts themselves plus a transcription should be given in the beginning to get the pronunciation right e.g. Polish "Małołączniak" pronounced Mow-o-won-chnyak/Slovak "Malolúčniak" pronounced Mal-o-looch-nyak. Then there's a question which version should be used in the text - Polish or Slovak as in this example. I stand for both ("Małołączniak/Malolúčniak").
I also agree with Borut that a version lacking diacritics is helpful for the search engine.
For alphabets other than latin a transcription should be used but the original form should also be mentioned in the beginning.

Translating names is just stupid - "Dolina Pięciu Stawów" is not "Valley of five ponds/Five Ponds' Valley" although you can literally translate it this way.

P.S.
The fact that English is commonly used as lingua franca doesn't change the fact that it's still not the most popular native language in the world. We use it to communicate internationally not because we find other languages useless. People using English as their second language don't automatically forget their mother tongues and still spend most of their lives speaking them. The thesis that we will soon stop to do so is pure nonsense and a sign of complete arrogance.

Well said, Petro.

Petro wrote:Translating names is just stupid - "Dolina Pięciu Stawów" is not "Valley of five ponds/Five Ponds' Valley" although you can literally translate it this way.

Depends on the translation (I'd say/write "the Valley of the Five Polish Tarns/Lakes"), the person (I like to know what e.g. Piatra Craiului/Kiralyko means) and being practical/impractical.

Yaksteak, Petrol and Byzantin,

Why argue so much on spelling issues? Especially when almost everybody is basically saying the same...

Bruno_Tibet wrote:Yaksteak, Petrol and Byzantin,

Why argue so much on spelling issues? Especially when almost everybody is basically saying the same...

Brutus,
Back to page 2.

yatsek wrote:It's never been me who feels unhappy because other SP members spell toponyms differently. To my mind, if someone feels uncomfortable with the English language and culture, why don't they look for fulfillment and happiness on a non-English site? (And I'm not referring to those who choose not to speak on the forum.)

Hope your snow leopards are having a blast anyway.