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Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:08 pm
by WalksWithBlackflies
So... it's snowing with 40 mph winds. Where do set up your stove and cook? Inside the tent or vestibule seems obvious, but I'm terrified of burning down my tent (with me in it) or poisoning myself with CO. Is this a semi-irrational fear, or do you set up windbreaks, etc and cook outside? I use either a MSR Whisperlite or cat can stove, depending on the temp.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:36 pm
by lcarreau
Hey, gotta eat! If your tent has a ventilation flap, you can use that and cook away. I've did it before, and I'm still alive and kicking.

At least, that's what my wife says.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 4:18 pm
by Baarb
Might be of interest, the one lower down is an MSR type with fuel bottle http://www.summitpost.org/hang-your-stove/483666

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 4:42 pm
by ExcitableBoy
The Chief has a pretty gory story of having to do the body recovery of two climbers who had rigged a hanging system for their liquid fueled stove. I have cooked many, many meals in the vestibule of my tents. Some tricks:

Always start a liquid fuel stove outside the vestib.ule so it doesn't flare up and burn the house down.

If camped on snow, dig a well inside the vestibule. This will make it easy to sit up and put boots on, but also makkes cooking in the vestibule a bit safer.

Keep a small bit of the vestibule flap zipped open to allow steam and CO out.

If you have a cannister stove, you can hang it. Make sure to vent the tent well. CO poisoning is not an irrational fear, it happens, so be careful.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:58 pm
by gert
I prefer canister stove unless in arctic conditions! Canister should contain a blend of Butan and Propan und you should be familiar on how to handle this in cold conditions. No need for a hanging system unless its cramped inside tent. White gas is a different story I would not use unless I have to!

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:51 pm
by rgg
I learned that the kind of stove and fuel makes a big difference.

My old stove, a Trangia, preferably burns denatured alcohol (aka methylated spirits). It's a pretty small flame in regular use, and no flare upon lighting it. The flame is enclosed very well, but if the burner is tossed over, the alcohol can easily escape. Inside a tent, that would lead to a life threatening situation, but the design of the stove makes it very hard to accidentally topple it. As long as my tent is able to withstand the storm, I can cook inside the closed vestibule, or, for added warmth, inside my tent - but the latter only when I'm alone.

Now, the main problem when cooking with alcohol is that it's slow. No problem for simmering, but it takes a while to get your water to a boil. Normally, I can live with that, because there's always enough to do during cooking - I'm talking about real cooking here, not just pooring water into freeze dried meals. However, recently I learned that at high altitude, where cooking takes longer anyway, it was just not workable anymore. And the final drop was that melting snow and making tea for breakfast took hours. So I started looking for another stove.

Climbing with different people gave me the opportunity to see different stoves in action. I had already read about the Jet Boil, which uses gas canisters. I didn't really trust it inside my tent, until one of my climbing partners brought one along and I saw for myself that there was no flare, and a relatively benign flame. Since the flame is not protected, and the burner can easily be toppled, I didn't want to use it inside my tent, but I used it in the closed vestibule in really crappy weather. It's much faster than alcohol, good enough for melting snow at high altitude, but I decided it wasn't for me, because gas isn't easily available all around the world. Besides, I had seen other stoves.

The one I decided to buy was an MSR Dragonfly, which preferably burns white gas. As for speed, it's just as fast as a Jet Boil for boiling water, and for real cooking it's in a league of it's own. However, it can give a big flare upon lighting, and the flame is wide open, making it very dangerous inside a tent. In bad weather, I open up the vestibule as much as the weather allows, then light the stove under a bit of open sky. The walls of the vestibule act as a wind break. There is no shelter against snowfall, but, more importantly, any flare will be harmless now. After lighting it, I sometimes move the stove a bit closer to the tent itself, but keep it in the vestibule. I don't know if this procedure will still work in a really big snow storm, haven't tried that yet. However, I guess that in that case I want to be in a snow cave instead of a tent anyway, and then there is no danger of burning my shelter. And I haven't figured out yet what to do when it's warmer and raining heavily.


So, to sum up my experiences:

1) Alcohol: relatively safe but quite slow, especially at high altitude. I've sometimes used it inside my tent.

2) Gas canisters: bit more dangerous and fast enough, even at high altitude. Never inside the tent, but usable in closed vestibule.

3) White gas is very dangerous and can give a flare, but (with the right stove) fast, even at high altitude. Only in open vestibule, and I don't yet know how to handle heavy rain.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:26 pm
by gert
one can use this http://www.primus.eu//Archive/Images/Re ... 00x400.jpg
to prevent a canister system from toppling over. Jetboil and MSR reactor sure quires more attention. I use a MSR superfly and Primus ETA pot. The advantadge is that you can use the warm water to warm up the cartridge every now and then if needed. The center of gravity is also much lower as with the Jetboil, MSR reactor. Sure one has to be very carefull inside tent :!:

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 12:06 am
by BigMitch
The safest is to make a windbreak and cook outside in the storm. But, that can be quite lonely and seem to take forever.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:04 am
by Wastral
It depends what white gas stove. My old white gas stove routinely produced a 2 foot flame. Drongfly XKG MSR stove I never have a startup flare over 12 inches high. Yea its heavy, but it cooks well and has no flare allowing me to cook inside along with its wide base so pots don't fall over when cooking on my snow shovel in the vestibule or hanging from the front arch pole.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 5:04 am
by johngenx
MSR Reactor with a JB hanging kit (minor mods) and it kicks ass for cooking when the weather sucks. Vent the tent, run the stove only as long as required, and try using dehydrated or freeze dried foods that don't require tons of cooking time. At -20C on the Columbia Icefields, we used 1 225g per day per two people for melting snow for rehydrating food, making drinks, etc. The best winter cooking system I've ever used. Sold my XGK!! (images don't seem to imbed, sorry...)

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/195/dscn3155p.jpg

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/51/dscn3156a.jpg

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 6:42 am
by dan2see
I like to carry a MSR Whisperlite with white gas, in winter because it's great for melting snow quickly.

But it's a real fire hazard. I cannot light the thing without setting fire to the surrounding terrain.

Well that's OK on a snowdrift, or on scree. But if there's any kind of vegetation, or structure, near-by, I will set fire to everything.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:39 pm
by Sierra Ledge Rat
I've always cooked inside of the tent during the winter with my MSR.

When possible, I cook in the vestible, though.

Only had one bad incident. We had a propane stove with the metal gas canisters. One morning the stove decided to start shooting flames everywhere. I was the unluckly lad sitting by the tent door, so when the other guys scooped up the flaming stove it got tossed to me. I fumbled the pass and dropped the stove into my lap. -POOF!- went my down pants. But I did get the stove out the door right after that.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 6:08 pm
by Hotoven
dan2see wrote:I like to carry a MSR Whisperlite with white gas, in winter because it's great for melting snow quickly.

But it's a real fire hazard. I cannot light the thing without setting fire to the surrounding terrain.

Well that's OK on a snowdrift, or on scree. But if there's any kind of vegetation, or structure, near-by, I will set fire to everything.


Yeah I like the white fuel too, but think I will invest in a reactor for my winter trips. White fuel is just to heavy to carry around.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 6:47 pm
by goldenhopper
It's a hard question to answer because there are so many factors.

Are you below or above treeline?
What kind of tent and stove are you using?
Is there snow on the ground and how deep?
Do you have an option to eat cold food?
Is there a liquid water source?
Do you have a tarp with you?

The answers to the question have nearly endless options based on the conditions, tolerance of person(s), terrain and gear involved.

Re: Cooking in Bad-Weather

PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2012 10:45 pm
by goldenhopper
Here you go... this will fix all your problems:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwB6cBoMqbE[/youtube]