Nice TP! Dimitrios leading the hikers' group description was hilarious...It happened to me several times to meet some of these "bergwatchers", during our dayhikes exploring a limestone's mountain in search for some new cave entrances. First they treat you like a dumb-ass just beacause they see you alone scrambling around. Simply they "need" to help you, even if you don't really need any. It's quite a "mission" for them, like a sheperd's dog towards its sheeps. :-)
In Sardinia, german tourists are well known for beeing tough hikers...you can reach the summit of a mountain in the middle of nowhere, no paths and no signs indicating the trail, and if you see a human face you can bet 90% of the times he/she's german, happy to be there and no lost at all.
I like/respect a lot your "freestyling attitude" (wich is also mine, by the way), nothing compares to discover a mountain on your own, hiking and scrambling where you please, at you own speed.
cheers.
PS: all that karst/caves and dolinas you reported sounded like paradise to me...;-)
It is frustrating to encounter people like that "guide." But it still sounds like you had a great outing. Good story, great pictures as always. Best regards from California.
I think he would have been a good guide had he led them into the Samaria Gorge or one of the other canyons of the island. I assume it's what he usually does. But somehow this group wanted to climb a mountain - and he didn't have the guts to say no. Somehow I think guys like this are really poor chaps - dominated by their insecurity as they are.
encounters with German mountain guides have been marked by looks of disapproval, scowling, and a general air of authority being sorely tested by the presence of a foolish know-nothing in their midst. It rolls off me like water on a duck. I've given up talking to them because I know the answers before I ask the question: "No, not possible, 5 hours at a MINIMUM, not dressed like that, not in those boots." I give them a wide berth and try to sneak around!
Crete looks beautiful though, I didn't know it was so rugged!
Just for the record: this guy was Greek. Maybe there is an international agreement between mountain guides to be incompetent?
And yes - rugged indeed. Though the mountains themselves don't look like it they are a pain to get to. Quite literallly since feet and legs hurt big time after a while of hopping on sharp limestone rock.
I really took to heart your description of Crete's 'featureless' mountains. A friend and I summited Psiloritis and got lost on the way back, added a couple of hours to our trip. He did the climb in thin foam sandals...with the limestone rock you can imagine how his feet felt the next day!
Thanks! I would have thought you can't get lost on Psiloritis but then four French climbers who had left the summit when we arrived managed to get lost on their way back. They only realized their error when they saw us from afar. They were still arguing about the right track when they caught up with us when we were having a break.
We climbed two more of the Levka Ori 2000ers and both - Melindaou and Kastro - were almost pathless on their tops. It took a good deal of common climbing sense to reach them - Well Kastro at least).
I assume that the limestone must have done away with your friend's sandals, hehe.
Do you know if the rocky summit to the NE is supposed to be higher than the round summit with the huge cairn? The Loraine Wilson book claims that the true summit of Gingilos is the latter, and it seems to be marked that way on my map (Anavasi 2006).
I climbed Gingilos about 2 weeks ago, and I couldn't tell. Some French climbers told me the NE summit was the real one. I like your collapsing cave theory, by the way. It definitely seems like something cataclysmic must've happened there not too long ago to produce those massive jumbles of rock.
It was great reading your report, thanks!
Gangolf Haub - Jun 11, 2007 1:43 am - Hasn't voted
Re: Gingilos
My guidebook claims the same so I think they are right. However the NE summit can't be higher by much. The same problem occurs with Volakias, which also has two summits. The northern one has a (fallen) summit column so I guess it's the real one. The other looked higher, though.
As for the "collapsing cave theory" - these things are not uncommmon on mountains like this. There are a lot of caves everywhere in the Levka Ori and there are far more dolines, indicating collapsed caves or crevices. You find exactly the same sturctures in the Madonie mountain range on Sicily, mailnly around Pizzo Carbonara, it's highest mountain:
http://www.summitpost.org/mountain/rock/218940/Pizzo-Carbonara.html
Efharisto for the the details on your TR. I have read them all and they are all quite good. I am planning on hiking several of the same summitts in Crete mid October. I know your trip was in May but I am hoping the weather will cooperate. Which guidebook did you use? It would help to know. regards.
banzai.barbara - Jun 1, 2007 11:09 am - Voted 10/10
keep up freestyling!Nice TP! Dimitrios leading the hikers' group description was hilarious...It happened to me several times to meet some of these "bergwatchers", during our dayhikes exploring a limestone's mountain in search for some new cave entrances. First they treat you like a dumb-ass just beacause they see you alone scrambling around. Simply they "need" to help you, even if you don't really need any. It's quite a "mission" for them, like a sheperd's dog towards its sheeps. :-)
In Sardinia, german tourists are well known for beeing tough hikers...you can reach the summit of a mountain in the middle of nowhere, no paths and no signs indicating the trail, and if you see a human face you can bet 90% of the times he/she's german, happy to be there and no lost at all.
I like/respect a lot your "freestyling attitude" (wich is also mine, by the way), nothing compares to discover a mountain on your own, hiking and scrambling where you please, at you own speed.
cheers.
PS: all that karst/caves and dolinas you reported sounded like paradise to me...;-)
Augie Medina - Jun 1, 2007 1:09 pm - Voted 10/10
Good StoryIt is frustrating to encounter people like that "guide." But it still sounds like you had a great outing. Good story, great pictures as always. Best regards from California.
Augie
Gangolf Haub - Jun 2, 2007 6:38 am - Hasn't voted
Re: Good StoryI think he would have been a good guide had he led them into the Samaria Gorge or one of the other canyons of the island. I assume it's what he usually does. But somehow this group wanted to climb a mountain - and he didn't have the guts to say no. Somehow I think guys like this are really poor chaps - dominated by their insecurity as they are.
mvs - Jun 3, 2007 10:24 pm - Voted 10/10
My few...encounters with German mountain guides have been marked by looks of disapproval, scowling, and a general air of authority being sorely tested by the presence of a foolish know-nothing in their midst. It rolls off me like water on a duck. I've given up talking to them because I know the answers before I ask the question: "No, not possible, 5 hours at a MINIMUM, not dressed like that, not in those boots." I give them a wide berth and try to sneak around!
Crete looks beautiful though, I didn't know it was so rugged!
Gangolf Haub - Jun 4, 2007 2:34 am - Hasn't voted
Re: My few...Just for the record: this guy was Greek. Maybe there is an international agreement between mountain guides to be incompetent?
And yes - rugged indeed. Though the mountains themselves don't look like it they are a pain to get to. Quite literallly since feet and legs hurt big time after a while of hopping on sharp limestone rock.
WoundedKnee - Jun 6, 2007 9:02 am - Hasn't voted
Nice TRI really took to heart your description of Crete's 'featureless' mountains. A friend and I summited Psiloritis and got lost on the way back, added a couple of hours to our trip. He did the climb in thin foam sandals...with the limestone rock you can imagine how his feet felt the next day!
Gangolf Haub - Jun 6, 2007 9:48 am - Hasn't voted
Re: Nice TRThanks! I would have thought you can't get lost on Psiloritis but then four French climbers who had left the summit when we arrived managed to get lost on their way back. They only realized their error when they saw us from afar. They were still arguing about the right track when they caught up with us when we were having a break.
We climbed two more of the Levka Ori 2000ers and both - Melindaou and Kastro - were almost pathless on their tops. It took a good deal of common climbing sense to reach them - Well Kastro at least).
I assume that the limestone must have done away with your friend's sandals, hehe.
dogberry - Jun 8, 2007 9:05 pm - Voted 10/10
GingilosDo you know if the rocky summit to the NE is supposed to be higher than the round summit with the huge cairn? The Loraine Wilson book claims that the true summit of Gingilos is the latter, and it seems to be marked that way on my map (Anavasi 2006).
I climbed Gingilos about 2 weeks ago, and I couldn't tell. Some French climbers told me the NE summit was the real one. I like your collapsing cave theory, by the way. It definitely seems like something cataclysmic must've happened there not too long ago to produce those massive jumbles of rock.
It was great reading your report, thanks!
Gangolf Haub - Jun 11, 2007 1:43 am - Hasn't voted
Re: GingilosMy guidebook claims the same so I think they are right. However the NE summit can't be higher by much. The same problem occurs with Volakias, which also has two summits. The northern one has a (fallen) summit column so I guess it's the real one. The other looked higher, though.
As for the "collapsing cave theory" - these things are not uncommmon on mountains like this. There are a lot of caves everywhere in the Levka Ori and there are far more dolines, indicating collapsed caves or crevices. You find exactly the same sturctures in the Madonie mountain range on Sicily, mailnly around Pizzo Carbonara, it's highest mountain:
http://www.summitpost.org/mountain/rock/218940/Pizzo-Carbonara.html
jfederl - Sep 23, 2007 5:10 pm - Hasn't voted
Thoroughly enjoyable read!Efharisto for the the details on your TR. I have read them all and they are all quite good. I am planning on hiking several of the same summitts in Crete mid October. I know your trip was in May but I am hoping the weather will cooperate. Which guidebook did you use? It would help to know. regards.