A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Shasta

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A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Shasta

by clmbr » Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:11 am

I am this climber and here is the link to my report what really happened and how I got out.

Falling in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Mt Shasta

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by Jesus Malverde » Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:46 pm

Clmbr,
Very glad you are still with us in this world. We seem to get a little "wiser" after those crevasse "experiences" huh? Glad to see that you are not growing tired of that mountain. I hope you see many, many more Shasta summits.
ten cuidado

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by AlexRts » Mon Sep 24, 2012 2:50 pm

What were you doing jumping around crevasses both unroped and without a partner nearby?

:?

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by clmbr » Mon Sep 24, 2012 3:48 pm

Jesus Malverde wrote:Clmbr,
Very glad you are still with us in this world. We seem to get a little "wiser" after those crevasse "experiences" huh? Glad to see that you are not growing tired of that mountain. I hope you see many, many more Shasta summits.
ten cuidado

Thanks, and I hope too.

AlexRts wrote:What were you doing jumping around crevasses both unroped and without a partner nearby?

:?

Practicing. :oops:

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by Skateboards2Scrapers » Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:07 pm

COOL STORY BRAH

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by Vitaliy M. » Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:47 pm

clmbr wrote:
AlexRts wrote:What were you doing jumping around crevasses both unroped and without a partner nearby?

:?

Practicing. :oops:


What sort of a glacier travel skill were you practicing ALONE on a broken up glacier while jumping over a large opened crevasse? Sounds like something extremely careless, again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlaBehEZ ... u.be&t=47s

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by clmbr » Mon Sep 24, 2012 6:25 pm

Vitaliy M. wrote:
clmbr wrote:
AlexRts wrote:What were you doing jumping around crevasses both unroped and without a partner nearby?

:?

Practicing. :oops:


What sort of a glacier travel skill were you practicing ALONE on a broken up glacier while jumping over a large opened crevasse? Sounds like something extremely careless, again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlaBehEZ ... u.be&t=47s

Vitaliy, as usually you have a good sense of humor. I knew someone would bring up the Vertical Limit scene. Hey but my jump was not even close to that :lol:

But seriously this jump did not look difficult at all. This was a hard ice and my tool most likely did not go deep enough or the ice broke or perhaps my ice tool spike angle changed as I was pulling up my body. It does not matter. What matter is I did not see this coming, had no backup plan in case something goes wrong, did not even consider using the other ax, was overconfident. And I am ashamed of that. This was indeed a dangerous move.

I’ve been traversing more complex and more broken up glaciers and climbing "reasonably" steep slopes alone for years and need to practice various techniques in various conditions in "reasonably safe" environment because some other times there is no time for practicing, just Implementation. You climb much worse stuff. Being roped not necessarily makes you safe but that is a very vast and controversial topic, with various opinions.

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by AlexRts » Mon Sep 24, 2012 7:20 pm

clmbr wrote:Being roped not necessarily makes you safe but that is a very vast and controversial topic, with various opinions.

Being roped in certain situations doesn't necessarily make you safer, but in the situation you were putting yourself in it certainly would have been safer. Do you not see that? You were not only exposing yourself by jumping crevasses alone but local SAR crews too.

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by Vitaliy M. » Mon Sep 24, 2012 7:33 pm

clmbr wrote:What matter is I did not see this coming, had no backup plan in case something goes wrong, did not even consider using the other ax, was overconfident. And I am ashamed of that. This was indeed a dangerous move.

I’ve been traversing more complex and more broken up glaciers and climbing "reasonably" steep slopes alone for years and need to practice various techniques in various conditions in "reasonably safe" environment because some other times there is no time for practicing, just Implementation. You climb much worse stuff. Being roped not necessarily makes you safe but that is a very vast and controversial topic, with various opinions.


Crossing a glacier roped to one-two other competent partners never been controversial- it is a norm. Would for sure help you if you broke/severely injured yourself in this fall. Even if they did not get you out (even though competent partners should have no problem with that) they would be able to get help. It is a good thing you admit to being overconfident and being ashamed of that though though.

To be honest, when I first saw your posts on the Bay Area Mountaineering group looking for partners to climb Shasta/Whitney in a storms I was a bit shocked. I thought it was a troll post at first. Who in their right mind would want to drive from Bay Area and climb into a winter storm. Aside from unsafe, it just does not sound fun. I hope this current event will be a lesson for you to avoid getting yourself into dangerous situations on purpose. Even though Shasta and Whitney are CA 14ers, they still kill multiple people every year. As climbers we should be READY to deal with situations, but we should NOT put ourselves in these dangerous situations on purpose. Of course it is your choice, and you can continue hiking glaciers solo/getting on peaks in winter storms, but I do not think it is a good idea.

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by mrchad9 » Mon Sep 24, 2012 7:40 pm

PellucidWombat has a good deal of experience with the consequences of taking on additional risk in the Cascades. Would be good to get his perspective on this.

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by Skateboards2Scrapers » Mon Sep 24, 2012 8:41 pm

WHY DIDN'T YOU BRING YOUR GOPRO BRAH? Gonna go back up and do a re-enaction with multiple frames of view, the go-pro, and bad narration next?

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by Skateboards2Scrapers » Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:03 pm

mrchad9 wrote:PellucidWombat has a good deal of experience with the consequences of taking on additional risk in the Cascades. Would be good to get his perspective on this.

agreed!!! want wombat input! the people demand wombat input

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by clmbr » Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:09 pm

Skateboards2Scrapers wrote:WHY DIDN'T YOU BRING YOUR GOPRO BRAH? Gonna go back up and do a re-enaction with multiple frames of view, the go-pro, and bad narration next?

I returned it because mine was overexposing on snow. And also this crevasse in GoPro would look like a giant and Vitaliy already compared my jump with the Hollywood one from Vertical Limit. I don’t think he would be able to find the proper movie to match GoPro. :)

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by Diggler » Tue Sep 25, 2012 1:24 am

The repeated lapses in judgment demonstrated here are extraordinary. While the entire incident is exceptional, perhaps the thing that's most exceptional is that it seems quite possible, from the self-analyses expressed in the story, that nothing was learned... If anything, I think that some things deserve scrutiny, so that other inexperienced glacier travelers don't fall into the same hole (pun intended).

At first I was shocked of why it happened because in my mind I did everything correct and it seemed to be easy and feasible to do.
The fact that this happened in the first place might be a good place to start self-analyzing whether or not the whole self-glacier crossing without a partner/walking over "questionable" snow bridges thing is a good idea or not- a lot of people might conclude that it was NOT a good idea upon falling into a crevasse.

I was not even mentally prepared for the failure. I usually expect the worst to be ready for the proper reaction but not this time.
Crossing a glacier by yourself & crossing sketch snow bridges- basically playing Russian Roulette on the side of a mountain, & saying you "usually expect the worst"????? Undoubtedly on of the best examples of self-denial, if I've ever heard one!

However, I feel a bit ashamed about what happened and the fact I did not even think that my axe might not hold in the ice. Perhaps I would have used both axes or just walked around. But this was supposed to be a crevasse crossing exercise and fun, not avoiding them. That was the purpose of this trip. I jumped over crevasses and crossed questionable bridges many times. Sometimes there is no other choice, especially on the way down.
Personally, if I were in that situation, the first 2 feelings I'd have would be 1. scared shitless, & 2. really stupid. "... a bit ashamed" would be WAY down the list. A "crevasse crossing exercise," alone & with no safety back-ups (rope, anchor, self-belay, ...)? Wow. The other, quite obvious choice, even when deciding to jump over crevasses, is to go with a partner & avoid questionable snow-bridges.

It would be nice to have new and razor sharp crampons for every climb. Maybe that would help in a situation like this
Sound judgment trumps equipment. Bachar didn't need Stealth rubber (TM) to solo Yosemite testpieces back in the day.

And now I’m trapped in that hole and have to figure out how to get out of it. Is it even possible? Of course it is. It always is.
Others should recognize that this statement is incorrect. It is NOT always possible. The author would do well to recognize his good fortune, & that this easily could have ended differently.

However, the rest of my climb stayed frustrating till I got back to my camp. While continuing climbing, though, ... I still crossed more crevasses on the way up and down but with paying respect to them, no more jumping over or crossing questionable bridges."
The fact that you continued going up, & putting yourself into similar situations is remarkable. It's safe to say that most others would have turned back at that point.

If you have no control, hope is the only what’s left.
It's important to realize that staying out of that situation from the get-go would have entailed "control."

Climb Safe I agree with this- the exact opposite of what is presented here.

I'd highly recommend reconsidering solo trips like this to the hills, if not for yourself, then at least for your friends & loved ones. If continuing glacier crossings are in the future, I'd highly recommend this book: http://www.amazon.com/Glacier-Travel-Cr ... 0898862507 I hope your luck holds out, & even more importantly, your judgment improves in the future.

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Re: A solo climber falls in a crevasse on Hotlum Glacier, Sh

by clmbr » Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:00 am

Vitaliy M. wrote:. . .
Crossing a glacier roped to one-two other competent partners never been controversial- it is a norm.

Norm for many but not all.

Vitaliy M. wrote:. Would for sure help you if you broke/severely injured yourself in this fall. Even if they did not get you out (even though competent partners should have no problem with that) they would be able to get help...

I've never needed help in the mountains (you never know what might happened in the future though), on the contrary, was helping others to get out of sh… and once on the safe ground some just ran away without any concern if I was still OK. So there is no guarantee.

Vitaliy M. wrote:. To be honest, when I first saw your posts on the Bay Area Mountaineering group looking for partners to climb Shasta/Whitney in a storms I was a bit shocked.

Sorry to scare you. I’ll avoid posts like this (or any) in the future.

Vitaliy M. wrote:Even though Shasta and Whitney are CA 14ers, they still kill multiple people every year.

I'm not new to mountaineering and heard/read that many times, but thanks.

Vitaliy M. wrote:As climbers we should be READY to deal with situations, but we should NOT put ourselves in these dangerous situations on purpose.

How can you be READY if you don't practice in such or similar situations? In which many people die because they thought they were READY. Do you know the purpose of drills?


Diggler wrote:The repeated lapses in judgment demonstrated here are extraordinary. While the entire incident is exceptional, perhaps the thing that's most exceptional is that it seems quite possible, from the self-analyses expressed in the story, that nothing was learned... If anything, I think that some things deserve scrutiny, so that other inexperienced glacier travelers don't fall into the same hole (pun intended).

A good idea.

Diggler wrote:At first I was shocked of why it happened because in my mind I did everything correct and it seemed to be easy and feasible to do.
The fact that this happened in the first place might be a good place to start self-analyzing whether or not the whole self-glacier crossing without a partner/walking over "questionable" snow bridges thing is a good idea or not- a lot of people might conclude that it was NOT a good idea upon falling into a crevasse.

a lot but not all.

Just to summarize the rest:

"Climb Safe" has different perspective for different people. It simly means don't get hurt. There are many people who climb solo and do really crazy and very, very "unsafe" things. I'm not even close to that. For me "Climb Safe" is doing whatever one might be comfortable doing without getting in accident or being rescued. Luck is the last thing I count on in the mountains. "Expect the worst and hope for the best," some people say. I say expect the worst so you would not be surprised, anticipate being ready for the right move if something happens. Do not panic if you are in trouble. Look around and think, there IS ALWAYS a solution; unless, you are dead or under avalanche, for instance. That is my point, never ever give up. You can't think negatively because you may die. You have to fight. And this is my primary message.

My mistake was "not to anticipate" and I am analyzing that factor how it was possible and programming my brain not to happen again. The rest of the experience is, again, a fight for my life. But fight, not praying for mercy or SAR.

As of climbing style, some people like to go with partners, some only with the professional guides, some other solo, and still some other solo and in solitude. But to belong to the last group you've better have a lot of experience (not just skills) and as Roper said, know what you are doing. And what I call experience are among things that Vitaliy avoids. Rope may sometimes become a death trap (e.g. Mt Hood 10 years ago). But if you are not a solo climber you will never understand that for the same purpose as many don't understand mountaineering at all. Fortunately, we live in democracy and everyone has right to be dissatisfied.


Thank you for reading and taking time to analyze my story. People will make mistakes but the important is what they do after. Will they be able to recover or just wait to die or for SAR to come?

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