True climbers go bare-ass.

Us pissers and moaners are just tryin' to save the rest of you from an emasculating dependency on COMPUTERS in the MOUNTAINS. Nevertheless, point taken, going elsewhere...

Yeti wrote:I'm dreaming of a GPS that spits out Altitude, Lattitude, and Longintude ONLY, and does it immediately when turned on. Not a handheld PC that needs tech support to use, just a little display with those three gems on it, so that I can find myself on my quad/chart, and be on my way. North/South would be nice, too, but I've got a compass.

Does such a simple device exsist?

Just so y'all know -- this is what the thread is about. Cheers

btw If you carry a digital watch or modern LED headlamp, you now have two computers with you .. they just don't look like computers.

My watch looks like a PDP-11, but it has a strap.

GPS simplicity; does it exist?

No, I don't think so

Diego Sahagún wrote:

GPS simplicity; does it exist?

No, I don't think so

Yes, but human simplicity does exist!

maps and compasses were once technological advancements themselves. if you really want to be old school, don't bring anything but your eyes

Dingus Milktoast wrote:I've never so much as held a hiker's GPS in my hand, not even in a store.

Why have they become mandatory equipment? I don't really get it.

I would dare say, to the OP, you clearly haven't needed a GPS heretofore. Why now?

There is value, in getting lost, btw. If you never ever get lost you will never be found, either. Nor will you experience the incredible universe of 'being lost.'

Now of course all the mundane 'just in case' examples will be submitted - glacier in a white out, continuous tree cover, etc.

SURE! By all means, if yer headed up into white out country take GPS!

But for every day whatever?

I - JUST - DON'T - GET - IT.

Like when someone asks me for the GPS coordinates to the base of a climb, I want to fucking SCREAM!

FIND IT YOURSELVES! Turn off your e-binkies and look up once and a while!

DMT

Yep......Whiteouts!!!! Sorry Yeti, I'm hijacking the thread off to the other tangent again. My wife bought me a hand-held GPS 4 or 5 years ago. I like dead reckoning, and if necessary, a map & compass. I played with my GPS a few times in my backyard, took on one trip and then put it in a drawer. To me it was just too many buttons to learn how to push and more batteries to replace. (Hell, I never even learned to really to program my VCR before it became obsolete.) That was up until a month ago when on a summit, my friend and I got separated in an extreme white-out. My friend ended up totally disoriented, in a snow shelter, eventually getting a SAR helicopter ride down the mountain. We failed as team. A GPS, a two-way radio, or a person-to-person transceiver could have kept us self sufficient and allowed us to find each other and would have allowed my friend to find his way down. So the electronic techno-gear may have its place. I know I'm gonna bone-up on using the newfangled tools and start taking them with me especially on Backcountry trips.

MoapaPk wrote:

Diego Sahagún wrote:

GPS simplicity; does it exist?

No, I don't think so

Yes, but human simplicity does exist!

GPS are not for simpletons mate

Diego Sahagún wrote:GPS are not for simpletons mate

I tricked you into saying it!

I've seen lots of people get lost misreading maps or misusing a compass.

In my opinion, 80% of the people using a GPS for hiking, are misusing the units.

This comes from someone who has used a GPS for more than 7 years. I know the limits; IMHO, most people do not. Perhaps my skepticism came from 35 years of experience with analytical instruments, and several years of mapping with a brunton compass and traditional surveying equipment.

Diego Sahagún wrote:

MoapaPk wrote:

Diego Sahagún wrote:

GPS simplicity; does it exist?

No, I don't think so

Yes, but human simplicity does exist!

GPS are not for simpletons mate

Neither were sextants when they showed up. Let's face it, you can't stop technology and it will end up being used out there more and more every day. Either get with it or 20 years from now you'll be bitchin at all the kids out in the mountains with 500 gram laptops with sat dishes telling them a GPS should be all they need. History repeats itself.

By the way, marine chronometers are for simpletons.

In whiteout conditions, I somewhat prefer the map and compass. It's just as relevant as a GPS for navigation. I suppose the one thing a GPS does bette(easier) is determining your location when you don't know it and when you are unable to see landmarks. The thing is, you actually have to prepare by plotting some bearings to follow when the fog rolls in.

But you can still use a number of things to help determine your location such as average slope (which can be compared to the spacing of contour lines), altitude (again, contour lines and I'm assuming most mountain travelers wear an altimeter watch and calibrate it at the start of a hike and at known points), and aspect of the slope you're on. There can't be too many places on a map that match all three of these bits of information unless you have not found your location for a LONG time, in which case, you're an idiot and shouldn't be out there anyway.

In any case, you should never leave your GPS turned on, as that's asking for dead batteries when you really need them to work.

I appreciate your concern DMT but don't worry. I don't use these instruments because I have a simple GPS!