V - you won't want to leave anything at the base cuz you won't be going back that way from Cox Col. You'll see that finding a joint position in the morraine will work fine. We left our down jackets there and suffered the whole climb just looking at them laying in the sun while we froze our asses off....in Sept. Had to cut steps coming down Cox Col with a nut tool - leave the crampons at home.

The Chief wrote:

Vitaliy M. wrote:Cool, I can see everyone's point. I will not bring them, if I will slip and die blame Chad and x15x15. I understand Mark's point, but I prefer to enjoy a climb by not bringing more gear than I really need to. I actually prefer bare minimum. 1 pack that will be exchanged based on who is leading and who is following. With one jacket for each, a hat, 1L of water, some energy gels, cell phone, topo. Stash the other back pack with more food and other misc stuff at the base.

When I was climbing in the Cascades this year (doing a carry over Liberty Ridge to Emmons as you have) my pack did not weight much at all, maybe 32lbs or so with all our camping gear (although I was able to get it down to 27lbs? when I did Whitney glacier on Shasta with Chad). Jetboil, gas, 3lb tent (divided for two), +freeze dried personal food/GU, personal clothes (could have cut some weight here too), sleeping bag (+10 down bag), 1 neo air sleeping pad (14 oz), other personal accessories. Worked great, and I wouldn't want to take anything extra for any other objective there. I want to be able to consistently get my pack down to 25lbs or so for overnight technical climbs where I need to carry my stuff all day.

What do you need all the above crap for....C-C from Mosq Flats in 11 hours max. Pack with rope and pro (10 pieces & 10 Alpine Draws at the most for this route) should weigh no less than 10lbs max. If this 50plus year old can do it regularly in under 11 hours, your 24 yrs old youngass surely should be more than capable of doing so...

I listed crap I brought over Liberty Ridge. For BCS I said I am only planning to bring a shell jacket, liter of water for the route, couple of energy gels and thats it. Agree with WML it is beautiful area, I been up that drainage 4 times now and would go back, and back, and back, can't get tired of it. NOT the place to built character IMO! I want to have fun with friends this weekend : )

Read Deb's post. That has nothing to do with "building character". Again, has to do with efficiency & experience. But what do we know, we have just done this route amongst others on BCS, several times.

Besides, it's Labor Day weekend and you will encounter several other parties wanting to do this same tick list route as you. So I most highly recommend you get an early alpine start if you do not want to get stuck behind others.

Thank you for help guys : ) Hope this tick list route is one for a reason.
Did anyone do both East and North Arete on BCS and has a preference based on rock quality, more sustained climbing, fun etc? Seems like Ruby Wall is the best place for climbing in that drainage though...

Deb is exactly right about leaving equip at the base of course.

http://images.summitpost.org/original/741125.jpg

Regarding the N vs. E, East sure looked fantastic! and really really long; the North only has 3 'mandatory' roped pitches (IMO) and then miles of simul; East looks far more committing, but I haven't attempted him; you would be far more likely to be alone on that route

The East Ridge is long but loads of fun and most certainly be clear of any parties. No one does this very Classic Vawter route.

The East Ridge is touch of 5.8 if you stay on the crest most of the way and couple short raps from the two towers (can be by-passed). Gerry Cox and I did it in 93, the crux was getting on the ridge. 22 pitches of mostly mid fifth class scrambling, took us 10 hours from Dade Lake to summit. Stay on the crest for the best rock and best climbing. Some love it (I do). I thought it was a great alpine route.

The North vs East Arete: They are a bit different climbs. The North is more of a rock climb, the East, much longer and alpine event. I would do North first if I had a choice. Weekends are very busy there, Labor Day might have a jam on the North Arete.

Ruby Wall is another story. Much better rock, harder climbs, alpine feel, solitude. Clearly the best.

The Chief wrote:The East Ridge is long but loads of fun and most certainly be clear of any parties. No one does this very Classic Vawter route.

Vawter route? It was written up in Roper's green guide. Galen Rowell did it thinking he was the first, until he found gear and Bob Harrington said he had done it earlier and was pretty sure that someone before him had done it. Hard to point to a first first on that one. While the route looks awesome (been on my list for years), from what I've read it's looser and the rock quality not as consistent as elsewhere on the peak.

Also, to get back to the crampon issue, while Deb said she cut steps with a nut tool, is that really any easier than just bringing a pair of light crampons? I admire the resourcefulness, but it seems like way more work in the long run. That's just me though.

BTW, bring a jacket/fleece, whatever. The route is on the cooler side (remember--NORTH Arete). Also, like Chief said, a light rack will suffice but I'd actually cut down on the number of draws and bring more runners. We simulclimbed after the fourth pitch I think (the wide one), and ended up using lots of runners.

fatdad wrote:

The Chief wrote:The East Ridge is long but loads of fun and most certainly be clear of any parties. No one does this very Classic Vawter route.

Vawter route? It was written up in Roper's green guide. Galen Rowell did it thinking he was the first, until he found gear and Bob Harrington said he had done it earlier and was pretty sure that someone before him had done it. Hard to point to a first first on that one. While the route looks awesome (been on my list for years), from what I've read it's looser and the rock quality not as consistent as elsewhere on the peak.

Also, to get back to the crampon issue, while Deb said she cut steps with a nut tool, is that really any easier than just bringing a pair of light crampons? I admire the resourcefulness, but it seems like way more work in the long run. That's just me though.

BTW, bring a jacket/fleece, whatever. The route is on the cooler side (remember--NORTH Arete). Also, like Chief said, a light rack will suffice but I'd actually cut down on the number of draws and bring more runners. We simulclimbed after the fourth pitch I think (the wide one), and ended up using lots of runners.

Yup!

According to both Secor and Moynier, JV and ST got the FA back '77.

Fatdad, Alpine Draws are Runners. Just tightened/looped up with two biners.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AERzcQ7xqog[/youtube]

Ruby Wall... now that is my territory. I have Four FA's on the North wall. One being posted on my Profile. CFFP, III 5.11a. I recommend to stay off the East Wall as one will indeed encounter some very loose bigass stuff (especially on the lower sections of the EB, Central Route and Daphne and then on the entire descent) where as the North wall is far more solid. Better be a solid .10 Trad BC Route climber for either section.

IMHO the rock is better on the N Arete than the E Arete, which has more exfoliating rock. From the summit you can always downclimb the NE Ridge if you don't want to haul up an ice axe. Also, check out the 5.10 variation if you do the N Arete. Have fun!

Vitaliy M. wrote:. . . but I prefer to enjoy a climb by not bringing more gear than I really need to. I actually prefer bare minimum.

V! What about the good 'ol days of humping 60 lbs of water up Mission Pk?

BCS N Arete is car-to-car is so easy that you should consider it a training climb & not one where you need to worry about going fast & light. You'll find it pretty chill

Remember, this was the climb where I carried the rope & rack on the approach, took on my partner's pack to speed him up the last 1,000 ft of gain (he carried nothing and I still was racing ahead), and then led all of the pitches with the larger pack (My Andanista Wild Things was pretty chill in the wide 5.8 corner & 5.6 Chimney). We did the whole route base to summit in 5 hrs, which I'd say was a decent time. We passed a party along the way that was decently experienced (they had done climbs on Incredible Hulk, so I imagine they had some sense of how to climb )

I have to admit, though, that while I carried my axe, I ditched my crampons at a big rock where the ascent & descent routes intersected. They could have made the descent less annoying but were by no means mandatory.

BTW, I'm aware that I may appear silly 'building character' by bringing needlessly bulky things on easier climbs, but eh, I think it helps me for the harder stuff. The 5.6 on Ptarmigan Ridge was no problem in crampons, even with a 30-40lb pack. My Andanista has been a fun companion on things like: 5.6 squeeze pitch of NW Books of Lembert Dome, Selaginella (wide first pitch was fun!), 5.6 chimney on Cathedral Pk, 5.6 chimney on Royal Arches, 5.8 wide corner variation on Matthes Crest last weekend during our full car-to-car traverse, 5.8 N Arete of BCS, etc. I'm expecting to feel pretty comfy wearing it on our upcoming winter climbs

E Arete is on the short list for next year. Interested? Or what do people who have climbed it think about how nice it might be in the winter?

fossana wrote:check out the 5.10 variation if you do the N Arete. Have fun!

5.10 variation instead of 5.8 OW/stem moves?
I was thinking to possibly check out a 5.9 fingers variation, but not sure yet how that is. Sounds like it will protect well

E Arete is on the short list for next year. Interested?Or what do people who have climbed it think about how nice it might be in the winter?

Sort of. There are a lot of things that could be nice next year, but for now would be nice to do some more climbing now! Wasn't FWA of North Arete done in the winter in 90s?
I also though fishhook was done for the first time in winter this year, but Chief said he climbed it in winter some time ago..do you have a FWA Chief? Very cool looking route, hope to try it this year..

And, as FatDad said, simul-climb after the 4th pitch. 'tis chill from there and once you're on the final ridge, you can mostly use running pro instead of gear & runners. I left the full 60m out and didn't get that bad of rope drag.

Don't forget to take the 5.9 finger variation on P2.

E ridge was done in winter, Parker and co. (I Think). I would think it would be very nice, skiing from Tom's Place some 18-20miles to Dade Lake, camping there and doing the Arete from Spire col.

Carrying extra weight also helps keep me entertained when climbing with slower partners (as half the climbs this year have been).

I just got my haul bag in the mail today, V, so maybe I can carry you up the next approach. My calves need more food > : - )