by Buz Groshong » Thu Nov 15, 2012 6:36 pm
by jdzaharia » Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:28 pm
by jfrishmanIII » Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:54 pm
by colinr » Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:59 pm
by lcarreau » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:55 pm
Of course the big problem is budget.
by Bubba Suess » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:58 pm
jfrishmanIII wrote:Thought-provoking topic, Bubba! I must say, I don't really mind that New Mexico flies a bit under the radar in the park system. We've got quite a few great Monuments, and those offer most of the benefits the Parks without attracting the same level of crowds. I agree with you that we do need places where people who require good access and amenities can appreciate the natural landscape, but I don't think it's necessarily elitist to prefer a low-profile approach in regard to new designations.
jfrishmanIII wrote:In regard to the Jemez specifically, I'm tempted to say the park idea is a solution in search of a problem. The one obvious candidate for that problem is the Valles Caldera Preserve, which is failing in its mandate to be self-sufficient and is very weirdly managed, resulting in lousy public access laden with strange red tape. If accessing the Preserve had only the bureaucratic hassles of the average national park, that would be a huge improvement from the current situation! (Although some changes are currently in the works which may improve both access and amenities.)
jfrishmanIII wrote:I don't feel that the Caldera on its own has sufficient attractions and interest to stand as a national park, but combined with Bandelier it's a possibility. There are a good number of folks in New Mexico advocating for just that solution.
jfrishmanIII wrote:Of course the big problem is budget.
jfrishmanIII wrote:All Bandelier's money is going towards mitigating the effects of the 2011 fire and floods at the main visitor center, while the backcountry trails are being neglected. They're in no position these days to take on management and maintenance of more land and roads and trails. Also, grazing and hunting are mandated to continue in the caldera, and any proposal to change that would have some tricky waters to navigate.
jfrishmanIII wrote:Your Pedernal and White Rock Canyon units are fun ideas. White Rock would make more sense as part of a Jemez Park; part of the canyon is already in Bandelier, and there are some great trails in other parts. A trail system that linked those with the ones in Bandelier would be awesome.
jfrishmanIII wrote:Pedernal, on the other hand, would face fierce opposition from the locals who run cows, cut wood, gather pinon and hunt up there, and it has decent access and is not particularly threatened the way things are. It also begs the question Why that area and not others? The Grulla Plateau, Teakettle Rock, San Pedro Parks, Gilman Tunnels and the mesas near Jemez Springs all come to mind as potential additions to such a park.
by Bubba Suess » Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:06 am
jfrishmanIII wrote:Pedernal, on the other hand, would face fierce opposition from the locals who run cows, cut wood, gather pinon and hunt up there, and it has decent access and is not particularly threatened the way things are.
by jfrishmanIII » Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:27 pm
by Bubba Suess » Sat Nov 17, 2012 12:57 am
jfrishmanIII wrote:The more I think on it, I believe you're right that such a park would definitely be the most sensible signature National Park for New Mexico, and would have enough recreation, scenery, geology, archeology and history to hold its own, more than some parks that come to mind.
jfrishmanIII wrote:(There's even rafting to be had in White Rock Canyon, though that run has some pretty major headaches.)
by chugach mtn boy » Sat Nov 17, 2012 8:03 pm
Buz Groshong wrote:It amazes me how spoiled you guys out west are when it comes to National Parks. There are already lots of National Parks out there, and they were created from Federal Government land at no cost to the western states. In order for us back east to have Shenandoah National Park, the state of Virginia had to buy the land and donate it to the Federal Government.
I guess it comes from that western attitude that says westerners should have the right to tell the Federal Government how to run its western property (without interference from easterners), even though it is owned by the wole country and was bought and paid for by easterners.
by jfrishmanIII » Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:03 am
Bubba Suess wrote:Just out of curiosity, which come to mind?
Bubba Suess wrote:What challenges are presented? Is it a long run?
by Bubba Suess » Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:39 am
Clark_Griswold wrote:The White Sands area is a good spot for a park, too bad there isn't much there, and the Lincoln NF is more like a NF in Texas, than a typical rugged, mountainous, and fairly wilderness like NF in New Mexico. Makes sense, since it gets over run by Texans in summer, but it is also pretty flat and roaded up.
The White Sands area is a good spot for a park, too bad there isn't much there
the Lincoln NF is more like a NF in Texas, than a typical rugged, mountainous, and fairly wilderness like NF in New Mexico. Makes sense, since it gets over run by Texans in summer, but it is also pretty flat and roaded up.
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