bscott wrote:

wallspeck wrote:Probably Ellen and Sally are much wiser now.

CLOSE.

From the linked thread, "I can think of only one mistake, and that was leaving our helmets in the trunk of my car."

I can think of only one mistake, and that was not wearing a helmet while reading that thread. Now my head hurts from banging it on the desk.

seano, now I'm REALLY laughing!!!!

Bob, your post on the site was respectful and I thought you were right on (for what its worth). Ellen, et al really have a hard time admitting they screwed up...

It's certainly OK to screw up, just learn from it...

(hi everyone)

---(in other news)---

Sean, got the two books last night. Sweet stuff. You're a stud. Thanks again.

bscott wrote:

wallspeck wrote:Probably Ellen and Sally are much wiser now.

CLOSE.

From the linked thread, "I can think of only one mistake, and that was leaving our helmets in the trunk of my car."

No, that’s not really a mistake. That’s what I tell people seeing their helmets on their backpacks rather than heads while straggling with the slope. Why to carry unnecessary items? A helmet has no advantage in climbing or self arrest, especially, in winter. Go light and fast!

However, I did not notice mentioning headlamps anywhere in the story. Perhaps that contributed to so early call for help. Many people are afraid of dark.

“Apparently, these conditions are similar to when numerous people died last year.” This is a good point. I’ll learn something from it too and definitely reconsider climbing some routes on Mt Shasta this summer due to fatalities on Avalanche Gulch and Clear Creek in the previous year. Or at least would get the SPOT device because my cell-phone has problem with reception up there; or, perhaps, switch to backpacking to stay safe.

Who died on Clear Creek? Seems impossible...

Thanks, Fletch! I hope you put the book to good use. Writing, publishing, and promoting it has been quite the learning experience for me.

Back on topic... It sounds like Ellen needs to invest in some real crampons. I bought a pair of KTS running-shoe crampons when I was in SoCal, and they were great for icy conditions on Baldy, San Gorgonio, etc. They're still one of my favorite pieces of gear, light and useful on pretty much any snow or ice where you don't need front points.

As far as screwups/"learning experiences", my biggest to date was definitely on Mount Robson in 2014. Coming from the North Cascades, I had been fairly aggressive in climbing despite bad weather; otherwise you spend a lot of days sitting around the library in Concrete. Despite a so-so forecast, I decided to go for it, and it was merely overcast until I got to the last few hundred feet of moderate ice on the south-side route. The summit was in the clouds, and I made the mistake of continuing up, figuring I could follow my tracks on the way back down. I ended up summiting inside a ping-pong ball, then spending a couple hours off-route downclimbing through a crevasse maze on the summit glacier. I made it down unharmed with no close calls, but I was lucky.

I still don't carry a SPOT, but now I always have a GPS with me when the weather might be less than ideal. I don't use it very often, but it's invaluable when I can't see and need to retrace my route or orient myself.

mrchad9 wrote:Who died on Clear Creek? Seems impossible...

I heard it happened to someone while crossing a snow patch. Well, apparently people die almost on every mountain, as sometimes rangers say, due to poor decisions; so at least these women got out form Mt Baldy intact.

clmbr wrote:

mrchad9 wrote:Who died on Clear Creek? Seems impossible...

I heard it happened to someone while crossing a snow patch. Well, apparently people die almost on every mountain, as sometimes rangers say, due to poor decisions; so at least these women got out form Mt Baldy intact.

About like a death on Lassen or Mount McLoughlin... but suppose anything can happen.

http://ktvl.com/news/local/fatal-accide ... unt-shasta

Still I think Spot is a horrid invention. Should only be used to show your spouse/friends where you are on the JMT or Denali or something like that. Not as your way out if you are not even injured and you simply decided to go do something you couldn't handle.

mrchad9 wrote:Still I think Spot is a horrid invention. Should only be used to show your spouse/friends where you are on the JMT or Denali or something like that. Not as your way out if you are not even injured and you simply decided to go do something you couldn't handle.

The Grand Canyon mule wranglers have charged uninjured people for "drag outs" since before SPOT was a thing. Maybe SAR should do the same.

mrchad9 wrote:Still I think Spot is a horrid invention. Should only be used to show your spouse/friends where you are on the JMT or Denali or something like that. Not as your way out if you are not even injured and you simply decided to go do something you couldn't handle.

Some people use SPOT not just for the mountains but for traveling to “questionable” places to send the OK notification every so often. If notifications stop, at least the last location may be known.

Long time ago I climbed Mt Shasta with a person who called his wife multiple times. On the summit he said he was going to call again after getting back to base camp. Unfortunately, he was not able to make that call (no reception or the battery died) and his wife called sheriff. Damn!!!

clmbr wrote:Long time ago I climbed Mt Shasta with a person who called his wife multiple times. On the summit he said he was going to call again after getting back to base camp. Unfortunately, he was not able to make that call (no reception or the battery died) and his wife called sheriff. Damn!!!

In April 2009, I did an overnight trip to climb Russell, Whitney, and Muir. I was carrying my wife’s cell phone and called twice, but I warned her that reception was marginal and she might not get any more calls. When she didn’t get any more calls, she started posting that I was late getting out (which I wasn’t) and asked about contacting SAR. After the dust settled, she got me a Spot so she would always know where I was.

Several years ago, I was climbing nearby Mt. Rose in the winter. I thought it would be OK without snowshoes, but the snow was much deeper than I expected, and it took 5+ hours up, rather than 2-3. I put Spot in track mode so my wife would know where I was. I also sent a custom message from the summit and two OK messages after I got down to the highway and started hiking back to my car. She called 911 twice, AFTER I sent the OK messages.

I did find a terrific use for Spot. I retired almost 9 years ago, and I send a Spot message to a buddy of mine at his work email every time I tag a summit. The messages begins “Hey, *ucker! Guess where I am!” I’ve sent him over 850 of those messages. Spot is worth every penny.

" did find a terrific use for Spot. I retired almost 9 years ago, and I send a Spot message to a buddy of mine at his work email every time I tag a summit. The messages begins “Hey, *ucker! Guess where I am!” I’ve sent him over 850 of those messages. Spot is worth every penny."

Brilliant!

Now we have a fatality and four injured in Azusa Canyon

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2017/02/ ... al-forest/

The injuries and fatality were near the PCT presumably between Islip Saddle and Little Jimmy. Post- 60 yr old Korean hikers that we've all probably met a dozen times before...

News is sketchy. Some conjecture is they left the trail and were short-cutting their way back to Highway 2. There are rescue photos and they sort of might indicate such, but hard to pinpoint.

Same deal as Register Ridge. Conditions got icy? No crampons or ice-axe, presumably.

One lady fell and companion tried to catch her. Both went 300'. Where is PCT near Islip Saddle that steep? Maybe only about a mile up?

clmbr wrote:. . .Well, apparently people die almost on every mountain, as sometimes rangers say, due to poor decisions; . . .

However, the sad part is people (most) often die in places or circumstances no one should die or even get hurt. Just use common sense before making any decision!!! Of course, bad things may still happen no matter what but much less likely.

Example: No ice axe, no crampons? Do not step on any slope with hard snow or ice where consequences of a fall (slipping) have a chance of ending up with injury or fatality. Do not count on luck! Always ask a question before making a move: what if? If you don’t like the answer, retrieve and find another way; there is always another way.

It’s not the mountain; its’ the route. It’s not the route; it’s the conditions.
And what I mean by conditions is a function of: route conditions (e.g. snow, ice, even on the trail), weather conditions (e.g. whiteout, high winds), climber/hiker conditions (physical and mental, skills, experience, gear, etc. for a specific route in specific route/weather conditions).

Again, use common sense people.