Hi everyone. I've edited this to now include Glacier as a possibility, due to the fire near the Sawtooths. Again, I appreciate the comments and advice.

Hoping some of you Sawtooth vets with experience might be able to answer a few questions for me! Sent out a couple of pm's, but, haven't heard back from anyone yet, so, thought I'd try here.

Possible upcoming trip with my son, who lives in Missoula, to the Sawtooths this weekend, extending into the week until . . Tues, as he has to be back to work midday on Wed in Missoula.

Anyway, I was in Stanley last summer, eating breakfast at that gem of a place, and was memorized by those Patagonia-like mountains jutting up from the near horizon. Been wanting to get back ever since, and while our time is limited, this is an opportunity.

Questions are: With limited time, wondering if we should backpack in to somewhere, ie, Sawtooth lake, be up high, etc. or, car camp at a less popular spot, such as Alturas lake, maybe Stanley lake if we can get in, and do day hikes, etc? Would love to get some exercise on this trip, so the idea of scrambling some peaks, swimming in lakes, sounds fantastic. I'll be coming up from Portland, btw.
If we backpack, do a small loop or find a good spot from which to do dayhikes and scrambles from?

So, that's one of the big questions, whether to car camp, or backpack. Crowds? If we backpack, and say, head into somewhere on Sunday morning, will we be able to find a spot? How crowded is it right now? Read some magazine article recently that hyped it up, saying it was a place of "solitude," etc. I find that hard to believe, but, wish that it were so! Same with car camping; what's the best spot to find a place to pitch are tent, if we're pulling into the area from Missoula, roughly late Sat. afternoon?
I heard there is a music festival going on this weekend, so the area could be crowded, etc. If the whole area is packed, I certainly don't want to drive the 4-5 hrs. from Missoula and be skunked on car camping, or backpacking, and would therefore just do something closer to Missoula, and sadly, save the Sawtooths for another time. .

Thanks in advance to anyone with any insights, experience, and advice on this!

Cheers!

There are two very active fires burning up there right now, the Pioneer which is making most of the smoke and the Dry Creek fire (90 percent contained) near Stanley Lake. The Stanley Lake road is open but there is fire equipment and activity in the area. If you hit it right and the wind is blowing you might miss the smoke. If you don't than all I can say is it sucks up there.

As for car camping, if you don't use the established campgrounds one can always find a "dirt" camping spot in the area. Unlike the national parks, camping is allowed on BLM and national forest land and the only restriction is open fires. I don't think I've ever paid for a camping spot up there unless it was at the Redfish Lake campground.

if I were going I'd backpack in and find a quiet spot. One of my favorite trips is to take the boat shuttle across Redfish and then hike in and camp. From the Redfish Creek trail one can go up to Alpine and Baron Lakes, Cramer Lake or even further depending upon your time and energy. The Redfish Creek drainage is one of the most beautiful places in the Sawtooths (IMO).

Here's a link to the Idaho Inciweb site where you can get up-to-date fire information.

http://inciweb.nwcg.gov/state/13/

Bob

Bob,
Thanks for the reply and suggestions.
Yeah, made a phone call today and gathered some info, etc. about the fires and possibility of smoke. . Sounds like the one near Stanley is almost contained, and perhaps will be by the time we get up there. . Yeah, sounds like one's current experience might be determined by which way the wind is blowing. .

And, yes, I did stumble across Baron lakes and Cramer lakes, which look very nice indeed. Hey, so to get to those lakes, should/must one take the boat across? Is that the easiest, quickest way to get to the trailhead, I take it?

Appreciate the reminder of just finding a spot for "dirt" camping. Sounds like that's easy to do.

We'll see! Much appreciated, Bob!

If I were you, I'd stick to the more southern area of the Sawtooths (entry points of Alturas, Petit, and Hell Roaring Lakes). All can be dayhiked, but if you want more solitude, backpacking in would be the way to go.

Alturas Lake - Alpine Creek drainage, great lakes to explore and it offers a pretty good hike up either Alpine Creek (Casper/Leah lake... aka lake 8522), or the North Fork of Alpine Creek (Lake 8523, potential lakes and peak bag of Snowyside peak from here).

Pettit Lake - Alice lake loop, although scenic... it can be extremely crowded. Could hit Farley, then Toxaway lake, then make the switchbacks up to Edna lake which would likely be less populated

Hell Roaring Lake - You could hike in the 5 miles to Hell Roaring, or take the easy way of parking at the upper trailhead to shave about 3 miles off (approx 2 miles in). From Hell Roaring, you could take the climbers trail up to the lake below the Finger of Fate (Clarice Lake), and push further to a string of 3 unnamed lakes. Or stay on the main trail and head up to Imogene with a potential of Payette Peak.

Up to date views of Stanley via the webcam offer a good idea on conditions:
http://www.sawtoothcamera.com/

Redfish Lake cam here:
http://discoversawtooth.org/webcam

Please ask any questions if you have any. Always welcome to offer any knowledge I have
~ Kris

I've walked the 5.5 mile trail from Redfish Lodge to the inlet of Redfish Creek many times but prefer to use the boat. You gain around 400' to the ridge and then loose it all at the other end. It is a beautiful hike but adds a lot of mileage to a round trip. The boat runs 7 days a weeks in the summer so even if you miss your scheduled pick-up they'll come back and get you if the boat is full. As for the drop-off, it's only a short walk from the boat dock to the boundary of the wildness area so the adventure begins quickly.

Hell Roaring is good advice as well. It's a bushwhack to the Finger but worth every bit of effort.

To get away from crowds I use the from Grandjean approach on the west. The hike up to Baron Lakes (10 miles+) is one of my favorites as well. Grandjean is probably getting heavy smoke right now so I wouldn't advise it for now.

The Alturas and Pettit side is beautiful but very popular. I go there in the fall when most people are gone.

Bob

Kris, why would you stay down toward the southern end? Smoke? Just personal preference?

Kind of leaning a little toward the Baron lakes area, and yes, Bob, I would take the boat as well!

Also, thinking about the White Cloud mountains, a little further south, but, maybe out of the smoke?
Just heard about the area today, and it sounds pretty nice. Anyone been to that area?

Yeah, Bob, I, too, would prefer a trip there in the fall, and may have to plan a return.

Thanks!

I just passed up a trip to the White Clouds last week and the group that went climbed Castle Peak. They had three days of clear skies when a little cold front came through and then on Saturday the crud poured in when the wind shifted. It's almost 100 again down here in the valley (10 percent humidity) and the Pioneer fire has blown up again. It's so big it's smoking out a big chunk of Idaho right now. It's going to take a cold front to move that cloud of carbon. It's approaching 80,000 acres or 125 square miles and is 50 percent contained. If you haven't been around a big fire like this you can't even imagine what a firestorm is like. This fire is so big it's making a cloud that can be seen for a hundred miles or more.

The hike to Baron via Alpine Lake on the Redfish side is stunning. Once you're up to Baron Lake there is a basin where you can find a private camp site if the lake is crowded.


Bob

I'm only a Sawtooth "vet" in the sense that I was just there in mid-July (for the 1st time!). I know very little I but I'll throw in what I do know.

As far as backpacking-I didn't go but did hike to Sawtooth lake, beautiful spot, did see some backpackers there. Seemed to be a fairly popular hike. Was there a month ago so the snow's probably gone now.

The reservable campsites in the popular spots are hard to get but there are a lot of 1st come 1st served campgrounds around. There should be good availability otherwise if you're arriving on Sunday. Seems that 80-90% of the people there are from Idaho.

The boat ride to the end of Redfish Lake is $16 RT.

It is a popular place but it wasn't ridiculously so like some of the places I regularly go to here in Colorado.

There were no fires when I was there. The temperatures swings are big-mornings at 30ish, afternoons near 80 degrees.

Sounds like you found the bakery in Stanley, great place!!

Hope your trip goes well!

Gorgeous area. Unfortunately, as Bob pointed out it's going to be a crapshoot as far as the smoke. You may get lucky and you may have no views. The highs are going to stick around for a while and there won't be much of a chance for the firefighters to make progress ...

As for suggestions, if you are prioritizing solitude, the West side suggestion is a good one. It's a long walk from Grandjean to the Baron Lakes, but gorgeous. But, as Bob mentioned, that area is going to be smoked out for a while. The White Clouds may have a better chance of clear skies. Good luck and hope you time it well!

Bob,
Yes, I know about the Pioneer fire, and that may change my plans on visiting the area, depending on how it goes over the next few days. Looks big. Thanks for that link about the fires above^. So, are you saying that the smoke is possibly worse down by Ketchum and the White Clouds, than it is around Stanley and the Sawtooths? Just looked at the cam for Stanley, and it's clear there, though it is morning, and I do understand about the wind shifting, etc. Shite, maybe it's too much of a gamble. . I certainly don't want to go there and be in smoke. We plan on 3 days or so, beginning either Sat. afternoon/evening, or Sunday morning. I was looking at some cams for Ketchum area yesterday, and the skies seemed kind of . . smoky there. . .
Yes, that boat ride and hike up to Baron lakes could be the one! IF I go there, that is. .

Bill, thanks for your info from your experience! Sounds like it is indeed a beautiful place. Glad you had a good time there. I hope to get there as well sooner or later. .

Again, I do appreciate the info guys!

Generally speaking, it's been worse up by Stanley. Below is the Ketchum webcam to check for day-to-day conditions and shifting winds ... it is a bit nasty at the moment. (edit: I just re-read your post and realize you probably already saw this webcam ...)

https://www.sunvalley.com/web-cams

dskoon wrote:Kris, why would you stay down toward the southern end? Smoke? Just personal preference?

A little of both actually. I think you are going to be in smoke regardless where you are, but looking at the webcams appears to be less smoke the further South you travel. From a backpacking standpoint, I feel there's less traffic in the Southern part of the range since you would be furthest away from the 'touristy' areas (Redfish and Stanley Lakes)

Due to the location of the Pioneer fire, I would opt away from the west facing side of the Sawtooths (Grandjean area). Grandjean is only about 30 min or so from the main activity of the fire (Lowman area), so smoke will definitely be more prevalent. Any sort of wind from the West is likely to blow it into Grandjean and up the drainages. If there's a wind coming from the South/SouthWest, I'd suspect you would be golden for most areas. Kind of a crapshoot, but your call.

http://inciweb.nwcg.gov/photos/IDBOF/20 ... 9-CDT.jpeg

You mention the White Clouds. Here's two TRs from Castle Peak last week.
You get there from the Stanley valley , so it's an option, and a little further east (more dispersed smoke).

This poster got lucky with the smoke....(need high clearance for this approach)
http://idahosummits.com/trip_reports/tr ... rip_id=198

And here's another post of the same trip, only done from the 4th of July trailhead (high clearance not required)
http://thegranolachronicles.blogspot.co ... idaho.html

Well Gents, I've been checking the progress of the fire every morning, and it continues to grow. Looking at the web cams periodically, it appears the smoke generally gets worse in the afternoons, though it doesn't look good around Sun Valley this morning, or last night, and a bit of the same for Stanley's cam looking toward the Sawtooths. . Unfortunate, but, it is what it is, eh?

So, I'll be playing it by ear and eye this coming weekend when I'm in Missoula with my son, and planning for departure. . Might just bag this idea of heading south to the Sawtooth's, etc. and maybe just head up to Glacier (shorter drive from Missoula), and join the crowds there. . Been awhile since we were in Glacier(boy is now 21, and I think we went when he was about 10 . . ), so a trip up there would be nice.

Should I start a new thread about Glacier? Lol! Seriously, if anyone does have suggestions for Glacier, I'd appreciate those!
I remember being there and getting a backcountry permit by showing up to do the walk-up thing, very early in the morning. . We did have to wait a day to get to our desired spot, but. . thinking this could be the way to go. . Problem is, we only have limited time-about 3 days. Thinking the east side might be less busy, around Two Medicine, and area I haven't really explored. Could go up to the far west side as well, Kintla lake, etc. Plan on showing up either late Sat. afternoon, or most likely, early Sunday morning. .

Anyway, I totally appreciate everyone's comments, insights and suggestions regarding the Sawtooths and White Clouds area, and we still may go there. However, given the drive and the real smoke possibility, I'm doubting a trip there right now. Sure hope to go back, maybe this fall, and I now have some great ideas of places to go. Thanks to everyone!

And again, anyone have any current advice on Glacier, camping and getting in, I'm all ears! Cheers!

NOAA predicts a change in the weather this Friday for the Sawtooth region. An east wind might clear the place out by the weekend like last week. Or... The change could end up making it worse.

http://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick.ph ... 7SaqJgrKUk

The last time I was at Redfish I drove so close to a fire I could see smoke moving on the hills above the highway and almost turned around. I persisted and when I drove around the "horn" the sky completely cleared. It stayed that way for the next three days.

I lived in Whitefish as a kid and the thing I remember best about Glacier was feeding the bears Ritz crackers. I wouldn't recommend it these days.

Good luck and post a TR when you get back.

Bob