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Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 11:38 pm
by Simkin
This site rates North Face of Mt. Ritter as class 3.

However, here is my video of ascending the route.

And here is Muir's description

At length, I found myself at the foot of a sheer drop in the bed of the avalanche channel, which seemed to bar all further progress. The tried dangers beneath seemed even greater than that of the cliff in front; therefore, after scanning its face again and again, I commenced to scale it, picking my holds with intense caution.

http://www.mtritter.org/mtritter/lucky7/muir.html

So is this class 3? And gear list seems incomplete since a cord to pull up the backpack would have been useful.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 12:29 am
by JD
It's class 3. Muir was off route. You probably were too but it's near impossible to tell from that bad wobbly gopro video you posted.

Thanks for the reminder that mountaineering isn't a spectator sport. It's fun to do but super dull to watch.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:26 am
by Simkin
There are only two chutes above the North glacier. The one in the video starts right at the apex of the glacier, which agrees with the description on summitpost. The first 12 feet of this chute are strictly vertical, which agrees with Muir's report.

There is also a shallow chute to the right of the apex. That one is class 3.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2015 8:18 am
by Sierra Ledge Rat
Dood

Looks like you were way off route.

If you go up the classic chute, once you hit the top of the chute you've got to traverse off left along the ramp.

If you don't traverse, and keep going up the ridge crest, it's class 5.

Image
http://www.summitpost.org/-north-face-routes-starting/25895/c-150499

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2015 10:52 pm
by Simkin
Sierra Ledge Rat wrote:Looks like you were way off route.

If you go up the classic chute, once you hit the top of the chute you've got to traverse off left along the ramp.

If you don't traverse, and keep going up the ridge crest, it's class 5.

If you actually watch the video you can see me going left along the ramp at 3:44.

The vertical part was at the very beginning of the chute right above the apex of the North glacier. May be the glacier melted or receded since the page was created.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2015 5:37 am
by Sierra Ledge Rat
Simkin wrote:May be the glacier melted or receded since the page was created.

You may be right
Couldn't tell where you were from your video
First time I did the classic chute I went straight up from the top of the chute and got into class 5 free solo
Second time I did the right chute and traversed of the other side

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 19, 2015 7:20 pm
by JD
Simkin wrote:The first 12 feet of this chute are strictly vertical, which agrees with Muir's report.

Muir's account is not a guidebook entry. When he wrote that the cliff was a "sheer drop" he wasn't claiming it was a ninety degree featureless face. He was just being dramatic. And his big epic moment occurred somewhere else, roughly halfway up the route.

That route has always had a serious nature to it both because it's not an easy class 3 and because the rock is kind of crummy. It's possible that the start has gotten more difficult. But it's very hard if not impossible to tell from your video what the angle is or how difficult it is. Ratings are not so easy to decide anyway. A bouldery move that in isolation would be called fifth class might be encountered in a class 3 route but not change the overall rating if the risk of injury is minimal. And starts of routes in particular are often given this sort of latitude.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Tue Oct 20, 2015 12:46 am
by Simkin
JD wrote:But it's very hard if not impossible to tell from your video what the angle is or how difficult it is.

I think that it is very easy to tell that it is vertical and class 4.

Image

Image

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2015 12:05 am
by Sierra Ledge Rat
I agree your video showed it to be very steep, almost looked like class 5, but I couldn't tell where you were in the video

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2015 8:51 pm
by fogey
Lots of people climb the north face of Ritter. The class 3 rating is pretty well established. The OP is probably right that the route he took was class 4 (there certainly are class 4 routes in the vicinity); the most likely explanation of that is that at some point he wasn't on the established route. Class 4 climbing has been reported on a number of other routes that I know from climbing them can be done class 3, and i've found class 4 climbing unintentionally by wandering off a class 3 route more than once. In this case, the location of the high point of the glacier after 4 consecutive drought years could well be significantly different from where it was, which would make it easy to start off the standard route.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Sat Oct 24, 2015 1:10 am
by JD
It would be nice if we could actually see the route with decent perspective. The gopro style of video is usually very distorted by the fisheye lens which gives everything an unreal, exaggerated quality. That coupled with the too-close viewpoint makes it very difficult to make any judgement. Who knows what's three feet to the left? If you were to present only those two stills you'd probably get people guessing it was 5.8 or harder. It's just not that useful (or entertaining) a video.

Your eyewitness account carries a little more weight. I can believe the start is class 4, or even 5.6. But the question is whether the route is class 3. Both can be true.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:29 am
by darinchadwick
Did you have to downclimb the same route, or did you find an easier alternative.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 4:18 pm
by bobpickering
JD wrote:I can believe the start is class 4, or even 5.6. But the question is whether the route is class 3. Both can be true.

I always thought the hardest move on a route determined its rating. How can a route with 5.6 moves be class 3?

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 8:22 pm
by asmrz
It really depends on who does the rating. Some of us find things harder and harder every year. Ratings stay the same, we don't.
3rd class route in the Sierra can indeed have a move or two of 5.6. That is given...If we don't accept that, most old routes on Sierra Peaks would have to be upgraded to crazy numbers.
Those early Sierra Pioneers did not pay attention to a harder move or two. If the route had 1,000' of third and few, widely spaced moves of 5th, it was still called third, and should be.

Re: Ritter, North face, class 3 or 4?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 8:33 pm
by Simkin
darinchadwick wrote:Did you have to downclimb the same route, or did you find an easier alternative.

I descended the Right hand chute, which is class 3.

JD wrote: I can believe the start is class 4, or even 5.6.

It is obviously not 5.6. Here is my video of a 5.6 route

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QGshD5qEG8

And here is how 5.6 holds look like.

Image

Obviously very different from class 4 holds pictured in my previous post. Not to mention that one can't climb a 5.6 in snow boots.