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mrchad9 wrote:

rhyang wrote:http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/bear_bag_hanging_technique.html

Cool link Rob. Let me ask to be sure I understand this correctly. After you are done hanging your food, the rope the twig is on is still hanging down freely within reach? But this is not an issue?

I use this set up in both black bear and grizzly country. You just need to make sure that you get a high enough branch, so the food ends up out of reach of a standing bear. I use very lightweight cord, which is even harder for a bear to deal with. My set up weighs something like 2 oz. Worthless of course above timberline...

apoica wrote:Although if you're in a trail camp on a popular area, I guess it would be tougher to avoid a camp-checking ranger. But it seems like avoiding those areas is probably the single best way to avoid food-seeking bears anyway.

+3 (three reasons there to avoid popular camps- crowded, 'friendly' rangers, and they are bear magnets). When I haul my crap into the woods, I don't like to feel like I'm in a drive-in campground.

rhyang/moni- looking forward to trying this out. Probably too high up this weekend, but will be using it soon, perhaps when I head to Sonora soon, had been planning on the Ursack for that one. Sounds like a good system. (it is simple, and not a burden... makes it easy to comply with)

Moni wrote:

mrchad9 wrote:

rhyang wrote:http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/bear_bag_hanging_technique.html

Cool link Rob. Let me ask to be sure I understand this correctly. After you are done hanging your food, the rope the twig is on is still hanging down freely within reach? But this is not an issue?

I use this set up in both black bear and grizzly country. You just need to make sure that you get a high enough branch, so the food ends up out of reach of a standing bear. I use very lightweight cord, which is even harder for a bear to deal with. My set up weighs something like 2 oz. Worthless of course above timberline...

I've had many bear encounters. Be careful hanging your food. Once in Pate Valley I had a bear shimmey up about 40 feet, reach out and cut the cord. Luckily my friend and I were standing close by. We watched as our stuff sacks full of food fell into the Tuolumne River. We shouted the bear off and retrieved our food, but a group of bears kept us awake all night long trying to get our food. During the night, they stole my pack--which I though was empty of food. I found it the next day, one pocket ripped and smeared with slobber and the toothpaste I had forgotten about.

You should always count on seeing a bear no matter where you are. I encountered a bear in upper Goddard Canyon, just below Martha Lake. He woke me up, leaning over my external frame pack which was wedged between two boulders about 10 feet from me. He was grabbing the top of the frame and pulling, trying to dislodge it. I jumped up, scooped a hand full of granite sand and threw it in his face. He shook his head, snorted and took off.

That was 30 years ago when I was young and stupid. Today I carry a Ursack. Follow the directions carefully and your food will be safe.

Cool stories! Must have been quite the event seeing it.

Perhaps I will try this hanging method with the Ursack- then the food can't get crushed, but if the system fails at least it wont get eaten.

mrchad9 wrote:Perhaps I will try this hanging method with the Ursack- then the food can't get crushed, but if the system fails at least it wont get eaten.

That's what I do. I don't really trust an ursack to keep a bear from eating my food, but it will keep birds, marmots, etc. out and the hanging will frustrate the bears (in areas where they are not so smart).

In at least one of the above examples, the area is inside Yosemite NP where regulations require bear canisters anyway.

Quick question about the Ursack and those who say it protects from the little creatures better than the big creatures - how do you keep them from getting in the hole at the cinch top? I mean, I crank that sucker down tight exactly per the instructions - doesn't look like a flea could get in, but sure enough a mouse found his way in one night at Lake Marjorie below Pinchot Pass (I spent the whole time chasing away marmots, turns out i was wasting my time with the wrong furballs). He only could have gotten in through the top since there were no holes in the bag itself.

I've heard that steel wool tucked in the opening works since the mice don't want to chew through that stuff. Anyone else had this problem?

If you don't want your car stolen don't park in West Oakland and if you don't want your food poached don't camp in Little Yosemite Valley. Secor wisely writes "the best way to avoid encountering a bear is to camp where you are not likely to meet a habituated bear". Forunately, most of the Sierra Nevada is safe from poaching bears without any special precautions. In 40+ years of backpacking I've seen bears on many occasions, but I've never observed a bear above 9,000 feet elevation and I've only ever seen one outside a National Park. In all those years I've never had my food poached, mostly by camping where the bears ain't. If you have to camp in a place where there are poaching bears use the newest method available. That way its less likely that the bear has had a chance to learn how to defeat it.

Bob Sihler wrote:

lcarreau wrote:Fur crying out loud ...!

Where's that beer? Bob Sihler said he would leave me one!

Are you kidding? I would never leave a beer for anyone or anything. Well, maybe something in a can (other than Guinness).

HEY, a cold Bohemian Brew would really hit the spot right now!

Geez, what a bunch of heartless folks, here on the Big SP ...

calipidder wrote:Quick question about the Ursack and those who say it protects from the little creatures better than the big creatures - how do you keep them from getting in the hole at the cinch top? I mean, I crank that sucker down tight exactly per the instructions - doesn't look like a flea could get in, but sure enough a mouse found his way in one night at Lake Marjorie below Pinchot Pass (I spent the whole time chasing away marmots, turns out i was wasting my time with the wrong furballs). He only could have gotten in through the top since there were no holes in the bag itself.

I've heard that steel wool tucked in the opening works since the mice don't want to chew through that stuff. Anyone else had this problem?

Works for me against both little and big creatures- not one versus the other- but my experience:

Mice can get in amazingly small places. Can certainly believe your surprise. We got mice in my building at work once, they got in file cabinets with seemingly no opening that would be feasible.

I never leave my Ursack on the ground. Usually tie it to a solid tree a few feet off the ground. Don't know if this is the difference but I've never had an issue, and marmots don't seem to get to it this way either. When above treeline, I use its cord (or its cord and an additional short one) to suspend it off a large rock, boulder, or nearby cliff. If you can hang it even just a couple feet above the ground and one or two below the top of a boulder, no small animals will get to it. If I'm in an area where I am not concerned with bear activity, this is also how I store my food when needed without an Ursack.

I once had my backpack stolen by a raccoon - I had to run him down to get it back. A pine marten stole Fred's toothbrush and we have had marmots chew boots and backpack straps, not to mention mouse and chipmunk problems.

sierraman wrote: but I've never observed a bear above 9,000 feet elevation

I've had to defend my food from bears twice. Both times we were above 9000 feet. And one of those times we were above 10,000 feet.

re: mice - I've definitely felt critters scurrying across my sleeping bag on occasion, but have not had mice problems with an ursack, at least not yet. As I mentioned earlier, mine is one of the older yellow aramid models they stopped making in 2003-2004 or so. I started using them in 2001.

I don't usually set it on the ground unless it's in an area like Gayley Camp above 12000' where all you have is granite slabs and snow And I don't tie it to a tree like the instructions say -- generally I hang it from something. Even if I'm just in Henry Coe state park I hang mine from a tree branch.

Certainly bears go higher than 9000 feet on occasion, although those environs are not particularly good bear habitat, but such an occurance must be a rarity. The chance of having your food poached by a bear at that altitude or above is low, so low that I would not normally worry about it (unless I was at some heavily used campsite). It is just like Secor says, the best defence is to camp where the bears aren't. Understanding their distribution and habits is part of following that advice

There are certain areas where you are guaranteed to see a bear. Places like: Hetch Hetchy, Pate Valley, anywhere near Yosemite Valley, or near Cedar Grove, but I've seen them in remote, less traveled places like Tehipite Valley. A big, healthy 400+ beauty, who took off like an agile defensive lineman when he saw me. No matter where I go, I always take precautions against bears. The one time you don't is when the bad ass muthas will show up, and ruin your trip.

If you're hanging your Ursack from a tree make sure the bear can't reach the cord it's hanging from, because if he does he's taking off with it. Otherwise tie it around the trunk of a medium sized tree using its long cord. Or use the big boulder method when above the tree line. It's easy.

I have never had any problems with mice getting into mine, and there's no way I'm carrying steel wool in my pack.

We saw fresh bear prints on snow on the west ridge of White Mountain Peak at ~12.5k'. In January no less; didn't even know there were bears on White. (Or it could just have been Rick Kent, who was there a day earlier and knew we were coming, playing a joke on us....)

I also use Ursack, hanging it off a branch or rock, and never had a problem. It's nice not having to worry about your food when you leave camp for the day. Only reports of Ursack's failure that I find truly credible (not due to user error, etc.) are ones where birds peck holes on it (you still don't loose much food). Never happened to me though.