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In June I climbed Mt. Shasta via Avalanche Gulch. It was my first time doing any type of "mountaineering," rather than just backpacking. I enjoyed it enough that I'm thinking it would be fun to tackle some of the SoCal mountains in winter such as Baldy and San Jacinto.

I need some advice on boots and crampons. For Shasta I rented, and I don't remember what I was using. I do remember I wasn't using plastics and the crampons were 12 point steel. The only boots I currently own are Vasque Breeze (Gor-Tex), and I'm guessing they probably aren't rigid enough to use with crampons. I'm trying not to break the bank, but I realize good gear can be expensive.

There are crampons with flexible connector bars made specifically for flexible soled foot wear such as the Grivel Air Tech Light aluminum crampons. They are not your cheapest crampon option though. If you are interested in pursuing more difficult mountains such as Mt Hood, Mt Rainier etc, you would be better off buying a good pair of crampon compatible boots with a reasonably priced pair of 12 point steel crampons.

Here are some at Sierra Trading Post that would fit the bill: http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/347, ... r-Men.html

http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/347, ... Women.html

http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/,201 ... r-Men.html

http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/,201 ... r-Men.html

http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/4282 ... r-Men.html

I have a pair of the Scarpa Summit and the Scarpa Manta. Both are excellent boots.

If you look around you can probably find some deals on crampons too. Here are a couple of suggestions:

http://www.mountaingear.com/pages/produ ... 114737/N/0

http://www.mountaingear.com/pages/produ ... 640622/N/0

Oy, this is a tough issue. Vasque Breeze are definitely soft boots, but you'll find many people have learned to use crampons with approach shoes.

When you pull the straps tight on soft boots, they will feel like crap -- your feet will initially feel like they are in tourniquets. The crampons best have a high back for strap-on models (the BD cheapo 10-pt steel crampons have a low back). Winding around your ankles is tough with low boots.

Whatever you pick for a boot-crampon combo, try them on together by walking around on grassy turf (assuming you live low and away from snow). You want to be absolutely sure the crampons will not pop off the boots, and you want to have the strap-tying be second nature.

Unless you have some fetish for going extremely light, or absolutely need sticky rubber soft boots for rock, get a stiffer pair of higher boots. I have some cheapo insulated Columbia boots with fairly stiff soles, 3.7 lbs/pair, and they seem to do well with crampons. I also have a pair of Kaylands with e-Vent liners, 3.6 lbs/pair, that are even stiffer. And for a compromise, I have a pair of Mad Rocks at 2.6 lbs/pair, with high-enough ankles for comfortable crampon use; they have stiff, sticky rubber soles, and were about $75, and I wore them with neoprene socks when on snow.

My best crampons for softer boots are the CAMP aluminum-- but they will get destroyed with much mixed climbing.

If you want to do much snow climbing in warmer weather, you will definitely want crampons with some sort of anti-balling plates. Most models sold in the last few years have the plates as a default.

If you climb with Vasque breeze and crampons in even mildly cold weather, your feet will get very, very cold. Part of this is just because of the constant conduction through the metal crampons to the very cold snow.

STP doesn't have many sizes in those boots right now...

Here's my advice: go pay retail for boots at Mammoth Mountaineering or other local shop (preferably not REI). Plan to spend several hours trying on boots. You will pay around $300, but you'll get some boots that actually fit you really well.

Crampons are easy - get whatever is on sale. They will all work with the exception of some wild stuff made for hard vertical ice. Look for steel construction (rock destroys aluminum, they are a special-use item) 10 or 12 points, flexible center bar, and straps with plastic sections like these:

http://www.altrec.com/black-diamond-equ ... erralID=NA

http://www.moosejaw.com/moosejaw/shop/p ... 006666____

Or, if you buy boots with a heel rand, hybrid straps like this:

http://www.moosejaw.com/moosejaw/shop/p ... 036990____

All three of those are excellent crampons, BTW. I like the Grivel best, but they are all fine.

Thanks for the advice! It would be nice to be able to go back to Shasta and do other big mountains without having to buy or rent gear again. I've also been considering the MR on Whitney maybe during Spring in a year or two.

I'm alright with getting more aggressive boots, but I don't really want to drop $400+ for La Sportiva Nepals if I don't have to. On the other hand, I'm OK with spending money to make sure I get the right gear. The biggest problem I'm having is figuring out what boots will really work well for what I want to do. Do I need insulated boots? Would the Sportiva Glaciers or Makalus be warm enough for bigger mountains during spring/summer? Any other advice/suggestions?

Download the Firefox add-on for Steepandcheap and keep your eyes open. They have been having really great deals on single boots lately, like $120 for Millet Radicals. Then, find some good cramps on sale and you'll be able to walk away for well under what you're expecting to spend.

I like Vasque boots. They run a little wide which suits me since I had to switch to wider footwear due to foot issues. I've been beating the crap out of my Breeze's over the summer. You could throw a pair of strap crampons on them (such as the BD Contact) for a patch or two of snow travel, but that would be a little sloppy/uncomfortable for all-day use.

If you have your size dialed in with the Breeze, see if the same size is listed here:

http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/2512 ... essed=true

The Vasque Optimators are my choice after the Breeze when I'm doing a fair amount of hiking but also anticipate sustained patches of snow. They have a heel notch so you can use hybrid crampons - strap on the front, bail in the back - which save a lot of time when you are taking them on and off. They have the Vibram Mulaz sole which is my absolute favorite - great grip when some rock climbing may be involved. They are fairly light.

Vasque unfortunately seems to have discontinued its alpine line, so get them while they last. If STP has your size, order a pair, wear them around the house, send them back if you are disappointed, it will only cost you $5. If you keep them, you got them at a bargain as the remainders get sold off.

(I did the same with the Millet Radicals - nice boot, but a little too narrow for me, drats. Great deals on Steep and Cheap, but bear in mind their no-returns policy, you gotta know exactly what you want.)

If you are serious about winter climbing, or plan to do glacier ascents you really need to get a good pair of insulated mountaineering boots. I like my LS Nepals and got them lightly used here on SP for half price. For crampons I recommend the Grivel G12's. Once adjusted for your boot they are very easy to put on and take off.

As far as crampons are concerned, when would I want 12 pt over 10 pt? I'm planning to use them in the SoCal mountains in winter and then perhaps on Whitney in late Winter or Spring. Most likely I won't be doing many glacier crossings.

10 point crampons are what I would call walking crampons. You engage all 10 points below your foot at the same time (flat footing), or the 4-5 side points if you happen to walk across a slope or the snow gets harder, or both. Trying to go directly up a slope in 10 point crampons becomes more and more difficult as the ange steepens. 12 point crampons have (at least) 2 extra points below the toes of your feet and allow you to "Front point". The term implies using those points for uphill progress. The more technical the terrain becomes, the more useless will 10 point crampons become, until at about 35-40 degrees, you'll find progress almost impossible. Any terrain approaching technical, and you would be advised to have 12 point crampons.

I'm a little confused by the distinction. Newer 10-pt crampons almost always have front points, and I have front-pointed on slopes over 40 degrees with such; I would certainly not try to ice climb.

I have an old pair (from ca 1969) of 10 point crampons, back from another time; they have no front points. Back then people cut steps.

I know people who used G10's on Denali, and also for a snow ascent of the Whitney MR.

BUt G12s aren't much heavier than G10s.

No need for confusion. 10 points are just that, ten points. Some crampons have front points, but that does not imply that one can do much with them. Let's try it this way, 10 point crampons are usually purchased by someone, who is not likely to venture past what I would call easy terrain. On steeper slopes, the equipmment, not the person, will be an impediment to safety and success. 12 point steel crampons are the standard gear for alpine terrain. If you ever think that a technical terrain might be in your future, buy 12 point, steel crampons. Make sure they really fit the outline of your boots. You'll never look back.

QITNL wrote:(I did the same with the Millet Radicals - nice boot, but a little too narrow for me, drats. Great deals on Steep and Cheap, but bear in mind their no-returns policy, you gotta know exactly what you want.)

Do you still have them? What size? Wanna sell them possibly?

No way would I recommend doing Whitney in winter/spring with anything less insulated than a La Sportiva Nepal or equivalent.