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Who the hell invented the term "trad" climbing? Was it sport climbers? God, I have the term "trad."

I say that we take back out climbing and not let sport climbers define what we do.

From now on, it's "real" climbing, not "trad."

If you're not with me, you're against me.

I have the feeling that it was "trad" climbers who invented it - to keep the moral high ground over sport climbers.

Okay, as long as it wasn't sport climbers who invented the term, I'm down with it.

Sierra Ledge Rat wrote:From now on, it's "real" climbing, not "trad."

Does that make free soloing "meta climbing"?

Maybe it's just me, but the way the term "trad" is used nowadays it comes across as implying something kinda backward, not with the times. I don't like it much. Before there was "trad" and "sport" there was just climbing, and discussions about style. I do think style matters, but not in an absolute sense. I just want people to be up front about how they did something.

FortMental wrote:"Trad" or "sport"? Do you put the yellow bandana in your left back pocket? Or do you put the red bandana in the front right pocket?

Do either on any crag in South Central and you're sure to get your ass blown away by the local hardcore "traditionalists".

FortMental wrote:"Trad" or "sport"? Do you put the yellow bandana in your left back pocket? Or do you put the red bandana in the front right pocket?

Here is Wevt Virginny we wear a red bandana around our necks -- "rednecks."

Steve Larson wrote:Maybe it's just me, but the way the term "trad" is used nowadays it comes across as implying something kinda backward, not with the times. I don't like it much. Before there was "trad" and "sport" there was just climbing, and discussions about style. I do think style matters, but not in an absolute sense. I just want people to be up front about how they did something.

I am surprised you got that take Steve. Been around a bit. Trad means it is a gear climb or at least mixed with fixed pro. Sport means clipping bolts, just bring draws. Never once thought of it as a negative connotation. I swear folks appear to over think the real climbing world and what is actually going on out here on a daily basis. Most everyone I know who does trad does sport as well. The natural progression for many climbers is to get further off the ground. There are less folks willing to lead on gear, but seek it out to gain access to the longer climbs if they are ambitious. Some boulderers and sport climbers are obviously very content working difficult problems and that is all they do. It is all good and I have never seen a disdain for any of it from within the industry, particularly anyone knocking on trad. It does not have as much to do about style as to what is available to many depending on where they live. Without sport, many cliffs would be unclimbable and most folks would have nowhere to climb locally and would thus stick to running, biking and the sort.

Folks will hear me for example say I won't climb sport with them.....but that is only because I have a family who climbs sport, therefore sport climbing is reserved for them. I can get more done and have a better time with my wife, dog, daughters, son in laws, grandson at the crag then I can forcing them up some trad climb together. It all serves its purpose. Just don't go bolting cracks or existing trad routes. That is what brings up the disdain within the community. I would not let that confuse one as to any infighting regarding sport-trad.

I think the term came about as a necessity. When there was only one kind of climbing, it didn't need a modifier. With sport climbing and bouldering and gym climbing and godknowswhatelse becoming so popular, you can't really just say climbing. I've met tons of folks who say they climb and have probably never been on a rope outdoors.

These days you could ask someone if they "want to go climbing?" And they wouldn't know if you meant in a gym, on a sport route, on a multipitch gear climb, or even to lug a huge mattress out to a 10-foot wall and fall on it all day. You pretty much have to specify, now.

I know plenty of climbs which have only bolts for protection which are not "sport."

Also, I share the dislike of the term "trad." It just does not roll of the tongue very nicely, and does little to dignifiy the style of climbing it is supposed to represent.

But then it is not as bad as a certain local good sport climber who used to call a climb requiring gear a "piece climb."

ksolem wrote:I know plenty of climbs which have only bolts for protection which are not "sport."

That´s true

charles wrote:

ksolem wrote:I know plenty of climbs which have only bolts for protection which are not "sport."

That´s true

(grabs a bag of pop-corn, sits back waiting for the flame war )

Nikolas_A wrote:

charles wrote:

ksolem wrote:I know plenty of climbs which have only bolts for protection which are not "sport."

That´s true

(grabs a bag of pop-corn, sits back waiting for the flame war )

And waits, and waits.......

Andinistaloco wrote:These days you could ask someone if they "want to go climbing?" And they wouldn't know if you meant in a gym, on a sport route, on a multipitch gear climb, or even to lug a huge mattress out to a 10-foot wall and fall on it all day. You pretty much have to specify, now.

With my climbing friends, the question that usually follows after someone asks if you want of go climbing is: where do you want to go? Once the location, or route choice is picked, the type of climbing is a foregone conclusion.

ksolem wrote:I know plenty of climbs which have only bolts for protection which are not "sport."

Also, I share the dislike of the term "trad."

Perfect..exactly.

Case in point, Stone Mountain NC.

Will definitely test the mettle of any climber, Tradist or Sportist. In most cases, the Sportist will be the first to back off and leave it for another day when their Sportist head evolves into a Climbers head.

BTW, Tom Higgins, the Grand Poopa of the term, has several routes that are "bolts only" and as Kris indicated, have been considered a "Trad" climb since their inception.

Dumbass Irrelevant Semantics.

It's like some out there that staunchly state that the Dry Flyer is the only true Fly Fisherman. Wrong.


You want the big fish..... gotta go deep.