I don't care to hear any debate on any religious (fairy tale) tomes. I've heard all I care to when it comes to the brainwashed trying to defend their particular brand of hideous lies. Nothing good comes from religion. Religions breed ignorance, intolerance, and bigotry. The sooner it's gone from the face of the Earth, the better off we'll all be.
Well, thanks at least for the compliments. Your 6 am Cotopaxi photo is amazing! I wish I could have spent less time in my life "keeping the sabbath holy" (indoors, of course), and de-brainwashing myself of religion, and more time in the mountains. You look like you've had some epic travels. I'd say don't sacrifice future ones just to learn in more detail why nonsense is nonsense; it's not worth it. We only have one life.
This is a quote from an interview given by David Attenborough, the well-known naturalist and film-maker.
"Every society that's ever existed has felt it necessary to have creation myths. Why should I believe one? People write to me and say: 'You show us birds and orchids and wonderful, beautiful things - don't you feel you should give credit to He who created those things?' My reply says: what about a parasitic worm that's boring through the eye of a four-year-old child on the bank of an African river? It confuses me that I should believe in a god who cares individually for each and every one of us and could allow that to happen".
Religions centred on a mythical deity will undoubtedly decline to a level where their adherents will be thought of as cranks. The internet is the tool which will bring this about, (just as printing put an end to 'The Dark Ages') - as will a greater understanding of Planet Earth - a phenomenon about which our forebears knew little and cared less.
Great article and an even better debate. The question of why people voted 10 came up earlier. I'd like to say that I voted 10 because the article was witty and to the point and frankly... I'm on your side Bob (the non-dilusional minority). Others said that it was sarcastic or abusive to others of different belief. Sure it was sarcastic... sometimes that's the best way! Maybe you did not intend it to be sarcastic but it's hard not to when you're talking about religion :) It's funny how people get their panties all in a bunch over this topic and just take things way too seriously. They can dish it but can't take it. Brecon & Sean, interesting posts. You would be welcome at my campfire debates anytime. I'm glad to see someone brought up Gaia. It's an interesting idea to think of all of us as one (complete opposite of organized religion IMO) Each of us having an effecton on the other, hopefully in a positive way. To me it's a spiritual but scientific idea. Spiritual in the way that you believe that all life (ie plants,animals,humans,even rocks) have some sort of connection or eneregy. They all form Gaia! But then you can look at it from a scientific point of view. Think of a food chain. Or how about this analagy... Some chemical company pollutes a river. First all the little things you can't see die... then the fish... then the local bird that usually fished those waters. Then the chemicals leach into the soil and kill all the beneficial bacteria that break down nutrients for the roots of plants. We are all connected somehow. Organized religion does the opposite. It seperates the masses. It makes you fear others that are different. That's the last thing this planet, the human race, or if you prefer Gaia, needs.
Bob, kudos on having the balls to write this article.
Yes, brainwashed religionists get very upset when you point out that their fairy tales are fairy tales. After all, a violent reaction to denial of their wacko beliefs is built in to their insane religions. And what's wrong with sarcasm?
Is my avatar not hardcore enough for you? Was just hanging out on a nice ledge at Tahquitz and thought I'd take a self portrait... Maybe I should strike a pose and it would be cooler!
Or are you refering to my screen name "atthecrux"? (Isn't an avatar your screen picture?) You may have interpreted it as "at the crux", "crux" being latin for cross? I think of it as being at the crux (ie. difficult or not obvious) part of a hard climb. So I guess it could be ironic in that sense, I never thought of it that way... Insert my foot in mouth as usual :)
I was referring to your screen name. Nowadays I tend to refer to both as avatars. Sorry about the lack of clarity there. I just thought it was a bit humorous.
To think that science can explain everything in nature is completely ignorant and very foolish. Yes, many natural, geological, and cosmic processes have been categorized and classified but, almost none of them have been given a defined origin. I am a Catholic, but believe in plate tectonics and all the great sciences you've named. I do not believe ALL was created by either, science, or creation. I would ask you to open your stern "ideals" and accepts facts which may not parallel your views. logic cannot, has never, and may never be able to explain everything and its origin. If you have some basic knowledge of world history you quickly come to realize that religion was one the main building blocks of every successful civilization since the dawn of man. To call it evil, well again is a very ignorant opinion.
Science does not try and explain everything..au contraire, science is always saying we dont know or our this is our best hypothesis or from our knowledge so far, we surmise...science is full of humility as it is based on falsifiability . It is religion that is ignorant and foolish by trying to explain everything by one dude sitting somewhere watching his ant farm.
and as for building blocks of civilization..maybe to a point, but I think we are very lucky that we (western) escaped the clutches of the Roman Catholic Church through the reformation and renaissance. The Catholic church was a vile, wicked, stifling and corrupt regime as anyone with a basic knowledge of world history will attest.
Boys, when will you grow up and learn how to speak with people and not throw your opinion into everything. It makes you sound extremely uneducated. Neither of your replies have made any point to your case, everything you've mentioned is pure opinion aside from the statement about pilgrims, it's laughable to think that our whole nation was built on escaping the catholic church. You just sound like two bullies trying to batter someone down. Maybe if their was any truth to your belief that religion is "evil" you wouldn't sound so fascist.
wasatchcrack - Jan 24, 2008 12:49 pm - Hasn't voted
Excellent Article
I too live in utah, and being raised in a place where children cannot play with other children because they are not mormon. Or parents telling their kids that the kid down the street is an evil heathen, has possibly skewed my opinion of religion in general. However some of my family is mormon some is not, I have seen both sides and heard both arguments (science and evolution versus god and religion) and I have come to the conclusion that religion and god is the largest epidemic of pure brainwashing to date. Religion was started as a means to explain our presence on this earth, and the natural world itself. It was created when the human race was still in its infancy in the absence of technology. It is severely outdated. You can teach and convince a child that anything is normal at a young age, religion uses the weakest point in the human psychological development to propel and spread itself, the most impressionable period, infancy to young adulthood. I am not trying to be insensitive or preach my point. I think to many it seems arguments such as this come across as provocative, but this is merely a defense mechanism taught by religion, again at a very young age, faith is a closed minded conviction.
Anyway just climb and enjoy the mountains!
outkasted, just the type of blind uneducated closed minded faith that this article was written because of. Now in order to see anything clearly we need to step back and take a perfectly nuetral point of view. learn each side of the argument, and thouroughly analyze something before we ever make a single judgment or declaration of faith. It is not enough to be analytical of anything alone, one must be constructively analytical, well armed with both fact and select opinion. Using the best of your logic. failure to employ this into any psychological or intelectual delvings ALWAYS result in a gross misrepresentation of the subject, not only to yourself but to all of those around you. And to resist temptation! Ha! well its because you only have one chance to make the best of the life you got, trust me i dont need god to not endulge in things that would harm my body. or someone else. if you need god to resist temptation, you my friend are a very weak person indeed
BobSmith - Jan 19, 2008 4:52 pm - Hasn't voted
Re: Well doneThanks.
I don't care to hear any debate on any religious (fairy tale) tomes. I've heard all I care to when it comes to the brainwashed trying to defend their particular brand of hideous lies. Nothing good comes from religion. Religions breed ignorance, intolerance, and bigotry. The sooner it's gone from the face of the Earth, the better off we'll all be.
seanpeckham - Jan 24, 2008 3:13 pm - Voted 5/10
wing man??Well, thanks at least for the compliments. Your 6 am Cotopaxi photo is amazing! I wish I could have spent less time in my life "keeping the sabbath holy" (indoors, of course), and de-brainwashing myself of religion, and more time in the mountains. You look like you've had some epic travels. I'd say don't sacrifice future ones just to learn in more detail why nonsense is nonsense; it's not worth it. We only have one life.
brecon35 - Jan 20, 2008 2:04 am - Voted 9/10
spread the wordThis is a quote from an interview given by David Attenborough, the well-known naturalist and film-maker.
"Every society that's ever existed has felt it necessary to have creation myths. Why should I believe one? People write to me and say: 'You show us birds and orchids and wonderful, beautiful things - don't you feel you should give credit to He who created those things?' My reply says: what about a parasitic worm that's boring through the eye of a four-year-old child on the bank of an African river? It confuses me that I should believe in a god who cares individually for each and every one of us and could allow that to happen".
Religions centred on a mythical deity will undoubtedly decline to a level where their adherents will be thought of as cranks. The internet is the tool which will bring this about, (just as printing put an end to 'The Dark Ages') - as will a greater understanding of Planet Earth - a phenomenon about which our forebears knew little and cared less.
BobSmith - Jan 20, 2008 12:46 pm - Hasn't voted
Re: spread the wordThat about sums it up.
Religion is a very bad idea. The concept is totally evil. There is a cure for that virus though. It's called logic.
atthecrux - Jan 20, 2008 3:59 am - Voted 10/10
Kudos!Great article and an even better debate. The question of why people voted 10 came up earlier. I'd like to say that I voted 10 because the article was witty and to the point and frankly... I'm on your side Bob (the non-dilusional minority). Others said that it was sarcastic or abusive to others of different belief. Sure it was sarcastic... sometimes that's the best way! Maybe you did not intend it to be sarcastic but it's hard not to when you're talking about religion :) It's funny how people get their panties all in a bunch over this topic and just take things way too seriously. They can dish it but can't take it. Brecon & Sean, interesting posts. You would be welcome at my campfire debates anytime. I'm glad to see someone brought up Gaia. It's an interesting idea to think of all of us as one (complete opposite of organized religion IMO) Each of us having an effecton on the other, hopefully in a positive way. To me it's a spiritual but scientific idea. Spiritual in the way that you believe that all life (ie plants,animals,humans,even rocks) have some sort of connection or eneregy. They all form Gaia! But then you can look at it from a scientific point of view. Think of a food chain. Or how about this analagy... Some chemical company pollutes a river. First all the little things you can't see die... then the fish... then the local bird that usually fished those waters. Then the chemicals leach into the soil and kill all the beneficial bacteria that break down nutrients for the roots of plants. We are all connected somehow. Organized religion does the opposite. It seperates the masses. It makes you fear others that are different. That's the last thing this planet, the human race, or if you prefer Gaia, needs.
Bob, kudos on having the balls to write this article.
BobSmith - Jan 20, 2008 11:12 am - Hasn't voted
Re: Kudos!Thanks!
Yes, brainwashed religionists get very upset when you point out that their fairy tales are fairy tales. After all, a violent reaction to denial of their wacko beliefs is built in to their insane religions. And what's wrong with sarcasm?
Bubba Suess - Jan 23, 2008 11:50 pm - Hasn't voted
Re: Kudos!Your avatar, "atthecrux" is fairly ironic.
atthecrux - Jan 24, 2008 4:14 pm - Voted 10/10
Ironic?Is my avatar not hardcore enough for you? Was just hanging out on a nice ledge at Tahquitz and thought I'd take a self portrait... Maybe I should strike a pose and it would be cooler!
atthecrux - Jan 24, 2008 6:08 pm - Voted 10/10
Re: Ironic?Or are you refering to my screen name "atthecrux"? (Isn't an avatar your screen picture?) You may have interpreted it as "at the crux", "crux" being latin for cross? I think of it as being at the crux (ie. difficult or not obvious) part of a hard climb. So I guess it could be ironic in that sense, I never thought of it that way... Insert my foot in mouth as usual :)
Bubba Suess - Jan 25, 2008 9:11 pm - Hasn't voted
Re: Ironic?I was referring to your screen name. Nowadays I tend to refer to both as avatars. Sorry about the lack of clarity there. I just thought it was a bit humorous.
helmut - Jan 23, 2008 9:12 pm - Hasn't voted
sarcasmSarcasm is, by definition, a tool of the narrow minded.
brecon35 - Jan 24, 2008 10:16 am - Voted 9/10
sarcasticSarcastic? Ironic? Sardonic? Satiric(al)? blah blah blah . . .
Please read the message - not just the envelope.
cbucker - Jan 24, 2008 11:21 am - Hasn't voted
Just bad science.....To think that science can explain everything in nature is completely ignorant and very foolish. Yes, many natural, geological, and cosmic processes have been categorized and classified but, almost none of them have been given a defined origin. I am a Catholic, but believe in plate tectonics and all the great sciences you've named. I do not believe ALL was created by either, science, or creation. I would ask you to open your stern "ideals" and accepts facts which may not parallel your views. logic cannot, has never, and may never be able to explain everything and its origin. If you have some basic knowledge of world history you quickly come to realize that religion was one the main building blocks of every successful civilization since the dawn of man. To call it evil, well again is a very ignorant opinion.
radson - Jan 27, 2008 2:03 pm - Voted 10/10
Re: Just bad science.....Science does not try and explain everything..au contraire, science is always saying we dont know or our this is our best hypothesis or from our knowledge so far, we surmise...science is full of humility as it is based on falsifiability . It is religion that is ignorant and foolish by trying to explain everything by one dude sitting somewhere watching his ant farm.
radson - Jan 27, 2008 2:16 pm - Voted 10/10
Re: Just bad science.....and as for building blocks of civilization..maybe to a point, but I think we are very lucky that we (western) escaped the clutches of the Roman Catholic Church through the reformation and renaissance. The Catholic church was a vile, wicked, stifling and corrupt regime as anyone with a basic knowledge of world history will attest.
BobSmith - Jan 27, 2008 2:46 pm - Hasn't voted
Re: Just bad science....."The Catholic church was a vile, wicked, stifling and corrupt regime as anyone with a basic knowledge of world history will attest."
Still is.
cbucker - Jan 31, 2008 11:39 am - Hasn't voted
Re: Just bad science.....Boys, when will you grow up and learn how to speak with people and not throw your opinion into everything. It makes you sound extremely uneducated. Neither of your replies have made any point to your case, everything you've mentioned is pure opinion aside from the statement about pilgrims, it's laughable to think that our whole nation was built on escaping the catholic church. You just sound like two bullies trying to batter someone down. Maybe if their was any truth to your belief that religion is "evil" you wouldn't sound so fascist.
wasatchcrack - Jan 24, 2008 12:49 pm - Hasn't voted
Excellent ArticleI too live in utah, and being raised in a place where children cannot play with other children because they are not mormon. Or parents telling their kids that the kid down the street is an evil heathen, has possibly skewed my opinion of religion in general. However some of my family is mormon some is not, I have seen both sides and heard both arguments (science and evolution versus god and religion) and I have come to the conclusion that religion and god is the largest epidemic of pure brainwashing to date. Religion was started as a means to explain our presence on this earth, and the natural world itself. It was created when the human race was still in its infancy in the absence of technology. It is severely outdated. You can teach and convince a child that anything is normal at a young age, religion uses the weakest point in the human psychological development to propel and spread itself, the most impressionable period, infancy to young adulthood. I am not trying to be insensitive or preach my point. I think to many it seems arguments such as this come across as provocative, but this is merely a defense mechanism taught by religion, again at a very young age, faith is a closed minded conviction.
Anyway just climb and enjoy the mountains!
BobSmith - Jan 24, 2008 4:56 pm - Hasn't voted
Re: Excellent ArticleI agree completely.
Christianity and Islam have a built in defense in the form of blind faith, which is a form of institutionalized insanity.
wasatchcrack - Feb 1, 2008 2:52 pm - Hasn't voted
Re: Excellent Articleoutkasted, just the type of blind uneducated closed minded faith that this article was written because of. Now in order to see anything clearly we need to step back and take a perfectly nuetral point of view. learn each side of the argument, and thouroughly analyze something before we ever make a single judgment or declaration of faith. It is not enough to be analytical of anything alone, one must be constructively analytical, well armed with both fact and select opinion. Using the best of your logic. failure to employ this into any psychological or intelectual delvings ALWAYS result in a gross misrepresentation of the subject, not only to yourself but to all of those around you. And to resist temptation! Ha! well its because you only have one chance to make the best of the life you got, trust me i dont need god to not endulge in things that would harm my body. or someone else. if you need god to resist temptation, you my friend are a very weak person indeed