by Marmaduke » Thu Feb 03, 2011 4:16 am
by Dow Williams » Thu Feb 03, 2011 5:42 am
Montana Matt wrote:Chris wrote:Yeah, did 4 last night @ -13F... have to keep the streak alive. Wasn't too bad except my eyes kept freezing open. Have a great run!! 55 sounds awesome... a little jealous here.
Yeah, I knew that you were streaking, so I wondered if you kept it alive despite the insanely cold temperatures. I should have known that you wouldDow Williams wrote:Who is responsible for fixing the site if you, as minority owner, are not? I find that a bit alarming. Thanks for the heads up.
I suppose I could have been a bit more wordy there. I meant to say that no, I don't feel like I'm 100% responsible for fixing problems on SP and the future of the site. But I am, at least, somewhat responsible given that I have some stake in SP.Dow Williams wrote:So we are clear, I would believe it quite fool hardy of you to maintain this site for free. If you paid $$$ for your minority stake or were given it in exchange for maintaining the site, then it is not free of course. You could get paid for this kind of Internet maintenance work if you are good at and want to get paid. Like tomorrow. We do have paid advertisers paying for the opportunity to sell products to folks perusing the the contributors beta on summitpost. All the contributors ask in return is that issues be fixed in a timely manner, not overnight, just not six months either.
What you say is right and I'm sorry that I've not been able to fix these issues in a timely manner, though I have spent many hours addressing them. And I do get paid by other people for whom I contract to do web work and that's why SP often takes a back burner to that work for which I get paid. My stake in SP is small enough that I don't really see a return on time invested month-to-month no matter how many hours I spend working on it. Therefore, my priority is to get work that pays hourly so I can pay the bills. I work on SP as I find the time. However, I've lately found myself stressing about the slowness of the site so often that I need to fix it just to get this monkey off my back, so to speak.Dow Williams wrote:You seem to attempt to imply I might have ulterior motives. I believe you might struggle to find one.
I don't think you have any ulterior motives and I'm not sure where I implied that. My main implication was that your posts come across as condescending and abrasive, and not that you have ulterior motives for doing so.Dow Williams wrote:You appear bothered by the "necessity" of a thread started by me, a serious climbing contributor who has spent almost zero time in the forums discussing such matters. I haev laid off all this time, showed incredible patience. Your comment deserved much more sarcasm then I let fly in my opinion.
Admittedly I'm tired of hearing complaints about the chat software and the slowness of the site. And I realized after my initial response that perhaps since you spend relatively little time on the forums, you've not seen the numerous posts with regards to those two problems that I have read many, many times. I apologize for not replying more appropriately to your initial post.Dow Williams wrote:I do not consider you a peon nor did I imply such.
I misinterpreted your text then because it certainly felt like it when reading your posts.Dow Williams wrote:But I damn well need to know if this is the total of the effort that is going into SP, chat rooms, games, etc, while it cost me more time to contribute each passing day. Like I said before, I imagine my time investment actually rivals yours.
I'm sure you spend many more hours contributing to SP most months than I do working on bug fixes, new features, etc. (though some months I do spend A LOT of time working on SP). But so you know, I will continue to work on fixing the slowness issues that SP has been having. There are a few other things I want to try that I think will alleviate some of the server load and speed up the site. I'll probably not be able to spend much time on it until next week though.
by Kiefer » Thu Feb 03, 2011 6:43 am
by Josh Lewis » Thu Feb 03, 2011 6:52 am
by mrchad9 » Thu Feb 03, 2011 7:27 am
Kiefer Thomas wrote:I haven't seen it addressed or mentioned, but I don't think anyone on this site actually wishes to attack you personally with all these changes.
The work and time you commit to this site go without say. And you probably should be paid for all you do...unquestionably.
Montana Matt wrote:Kiefer Thomas wrote:how do games and add-on's add to the value of a mountaineering website (wikisite)?
By allowing people to communicate more efficiently and effectively.
by Bob Sihler » Thu Feb 03, 2011 12:50 pm
Kiefer Thomas wrote:BTW: What about adding a forum devoted to JUST classifieds and selling gear?
by The Chief » Thu Feb 03, 2011 1:40 pm
chugach mtn boy wrote:Dow Williams wrote:Well the disingenuous pats will be forth coming as I predicted whether you care for them or not, just the nature of this site. But as I also said, I know you know better. I consider you a more sincere individual than some of these Internet personalities. I do not consider you a peon nor did I imply such. But I damn well need to know if this is the total of the effort that is going into SP, chat rooms, games, etc, while it cost me more time to contribute each passing day. Like I said before, I imagine my time investment actually rivals yours.
The pats are not disingenuous, Dow. There are many of us who use this site who realize that all of the people involved in running it are, for all practical purposes, volunteers. Some of us have real, responsible jobs and roles in our communities in which we have learned how to treat volunteers. Your approach is not it.
The seething hostility and contempt for just about everybody that comes through in your posts is really pretty breathtaking. Maybe you don't see it. If not, have your wife or GF or somebody read over your shoulder before you push submit.
With that said, you contribute an impressive amount to this site. But it seems to me that you are better compensated for that than just about any other contributor, because for you, the exposure you get from SP is good for business--or for whatever it is you seek from your profession as a "full time climber." It is not a labor of love for you. SP frees you from self-promotion by other means. As you say on your website:
"I no longer update this site on a regular basis. Rather I encourage you to visit my
work on summitpost.org ...."
Because SP is important to you professionally, it is understandable that you care quite a bit about how it is run. That's fine. But there may be more effective ways to communicate your concerns.
by John Duffield » Thu Feb 03, 2011 3:27 pm
knoback wrote: you have to admit, his route pages are kind of the benchmark.
by Josh Lewis » Thu Feb 03, 2011 4:24 pm
Kiefer Thomas wrote:BTW: What about adding a forum devoted to JUST classifieds and selling gear?
Post climbing gear-related questions, offer advice. An ideal section for classifieds, as well.
by mvs » Thu Feb 03, 2011 4:53 pm
by lcarreau » Thu Feb 03, 2011 5:43 pm
by Josh Lewis » Thu Feb 03, 2011 5:59 pm
by lcarreau » Thu Feb 03, 2011 7:16 pm
butitsadryheat wrote:Smart man, that Belichick!
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