PC,

We are new members of HPC but their recognition is not what we seek. It took a year and six HPs before we decided to join. Also, I posted this to "Bark Eater": "No worries about me creating any rogue or unauthorized trails. I would only do it once I had obtained permission from all applicable stakeholders and I would prefer to do it as part of a group." I probably should have written "authorized" group" just to be clear. Why I would have to write any of this is beyond me.

The state boundary is wrong on many maps, not just one which is what prompted my question. I accept the boundary as being along the highpoints of the Appalachians between the two states so the question is answered for me.

Happy trails!

Mark, I didn't mean any disrespect with the trail cutting comment. I didn't know your background. In the past, there have been some famous stories of well-meaning people cutting trail in wilderness areas, getting caught, and then being socked with horrific fines.

The "UFO" at Clingman's Dome (top of the man-made, wheelchair-accessible tower) is in North Carolina. This is obvious on several different maps.

The mountain itself, at 6643/6644' however, IS the highest in Tennessee, period. The talk of Guyout is pure nonsense. NONSENSE! There would *at least* have to be another closed contour on Guyot's summit for it to be higher. Just because a ridge/mountain continues higher in the adjacent state doesn't nullify its standing: Several states have highpoints that aren't summits:

1. Boundary Peak, NV - the mountain continues higher, after a saddle, in California.
2. Frissell Point, CT - "the green stake" marks the state line - the ridge continues several hundred feet into MA. (However, in this instance, the highest *summit* of CT is very close and the two can be done in the same day.)

3. Black Mesa, OK - the mesa continues for miles, and higher, into New Mexico.

4. (?) Clingman's Dome - possibly the exact highest point on that summit is in NC, but regardless, the summit is the highest in TN - so you pass it when you walk up the trail.

Finally, there's no official USGS Benchmark at the true summit historically. That's why older topos show an "X" and not the letters "BM" (like you see at the trailhead) next to the elevation.
Any questions?

(I've done 34 of the state highpoints and am aiming for 49!!)

I think this is my first post here. We'll see after I hit submit.

I've been curious about this for some time. I am fairly sure that the peak of Clingmans is entirely in North Carolina. If you look at the peak from the side (profile), which you can do somewhat on Google Maps, it looks quite clear that the tower is not at the peak. The peak appears to be to the south-east of the tower. Under the Wikipedia article on CD, I asked about this on the "Talk" section. Someone who, I think, knows what he or she is talking about wrote this: "The tower is north of the peak to preserve the site and to gain grade for the lower ramp. The USGS 2016 7.5 minute topo suggests more than 6600 but maybe less than 6640. USGS pubs have it at 6643. This NPS pub lists it at 6660. My guess is that the 6660 is an old datum. Go find out for sure, knock yourself out. IveGoneAway (talk) 01:22, 17 August 2017 (UTC) 01:25, 17 August 2017 (UTC)"

I've poked around on the altitude.nu website, which I've been told by a surveyor is pretty accurate even if not exact. In doing that, I found a peak number of 6660 ft. I also found an old North Carolina publication listing the height at 6660. I don't know why the NPS wouldn't list the height at this figure. Maybe because of the 666? Maybe because they want people to think that the tower is at the peak? Maybe, also, because they don't want people straying off the beaten path trying to find the USGS marker. And I'll be there is one. One thing for sure is that the NPS doesn't like talking about it. And most of the rangers I've run into are either clueless or have been told not to talk about it.

As for which state the tower is in, I have two good sources that say the pedestal is entirely in Tennessee, while the observation area hovers half over Tennessee and half over North Carolina. I called the NPS office in Gatlinburg and was told this. There is also a book on the park that shows the state line as described by the NPS.

So even if the tower is not at the peak of the mountain, the tower is still at the highest point in Tennessee.

For anyone curious, the original Act of Cession defining the border is here:

http://docsouth.unc.edu/csr/index.php/d ... csr25-0001 (scroll down to Chapter III)

(The border was further defined by a two-state commission in 1820, and two US Supreme Court cases in the early 20th C, but those changes aren't relevant to Clingman's Dome.)

It defines the border as passing over the highest point. That point is likely (slightly) different from the location of the tower. My guess is that the natural high point is inside the loop of the ramp. Note there is no benchmark on that point.

Re the 6660 height: as "I'veGoneAway" noted, that could be an older measurement using an older "datum." A "datum" in this context means a model for "sea level" - it's necessarily an approximation, and choice of datum can affect your results by tens of meters.

An even more likely explanation is that "6660" is an interpolation. They were confident that the peak is above 6640 but below 6680, but they didn't measure it any more precisely than that. It's a suspiciously round number. You see this all the time in surveying: estimated height = height of last mapped contour plus half the contour size.