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This is kind of disturbing.

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This is kind of disturbing.

Postby philoparts » Wed May 23, 2012 10:50 pm

http://unofficialnetworks.com/dangerous-piece-avalanche-safety-gear-world-snowbe-98574/

Why carry a beacon that you can't search with?

Wearing the “Snow-Be” means that if you get buried in an avalanche, only someone with a real avalanche transceiver could potentially find you. But, if your partner has a Snow-Be as well, you’re shit outta luck as your “Snow-Be” HAS NO SEARCH MODE.
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby DanTheMan » Thu May 24, 2012 5:10 am

for children and tourists
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby lcarreau » Thu May 24, 2012 5:42 am

Technology is a strange mistress ... don't put all your faith into it.
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby Sierra Ledge Rat » Thu May 24, 2012 5:43 am

From the Snow-Beacon webiste (and I quote):

"When switched on, snow-beacon signals your location at all times.

Please be aware snow-be has no search function and you cannot find anyone with or using it."
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby Arthur Digbee » Thu May 24, 2012 11:52 am

Get the Snow-Be for everyone in the party except the luckiest, who gets one with a search function. The luckiest person won't be buried in the avalanche, and can find everyone else. No problem.
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby DanTheMan » Thu May 24, 2012 4:32 pm

So say your 6 year old is with you and a group of adults skiing to a hut in the backcountry. Maybe it's a low risk environment, but you want to play it extra safe anyways, so everyone carries a beacon. Now supposing that there IS some freak avalanche, is the 6 year old going to be a big help looking for others? Would you even want them wandering around on their own with a beacon locator? Basically, put it on anyone you would like to be able to find but would be unhelpful or incapable of finding others.

I also have a feeling it might be geared more towards safety minded people in commercial ski areas where there is a ski patrol.
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby philoparts » Thu May 24, 2012 6:46 pm

Looks like the completely changed their website and removed all mention of backcountry skiing and to use this device inbounds only.

If you're going to take your 6 year old skiing in the backcountry, they should know exactly what to do in the event of an avalanche. Train them as you would any adult, or leave them at home. I started going hunting, fishing and whatnot with my dad by the age of 5. I was already learning map and compass and survival skills by then, and could drive our old Landcruiser by the age of 8. My dad theorized that if anything happened to him, I could at least find my way to the rig, and get myself to somewhere to find help.

I currently haven't taken a full 3 day avy course, but I will before I spend any time in potentially high danger conditions. I also will not go without a beacon, probe, and shovel, or with people without the proper gear or training. If my life is on the line, I want people searching for me with the proper gear and training, because I will only have minutes. I also need to be trained as an effective searcher to help anyone in my group that may be buried. Wilderness Medical Society hypothermia protocols specific to avalanche burial give you 30 minutes under the most ideal conditions: air pocket, no severe trauma, and core temp still above 90f/32c. In reality, without an Avalung or BCA Float pack, your chances of survival after more than 5 minutes of burial are slim. Just ask a good friend of mine who has pulled people both dead and alive from avalanches. 5 minutes, both times, and the one who lived had an Avalung.
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby nebclimber » Tue May 29, 2012 6:32 pm

My dog has worn a beacon that only transmits when traveling with me in potential avalanche terrain. I have also used it in a controlled setting to practice searches.
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby Kai » Tue May 29, 2012 11:18 pm

I prefer the avalanche poodle.

Has never failed me yet.

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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby JHH60 » Thu May 31, 2012 9:50 pm

This product might be attractive to guide services. It looks like several guide services for Rainier, e.g., offer loaner beacons to their clients as part of the basic climb package but don't list avalanche training (formal or otherwise) as a prerequisite for the climb. Perhaps they cover basic beacon search techniques in their snow skills review at Camp Muir or whatever, but I think it's more likely they assume that any searching and rescuing (from avalanches, crevasses, whatever) will be done by guides. In which case a $75 device that can only be used passively might suit the guide services' needs as well as a $300+ full featured beacon.

I'm not saying I think this is a great idea. When I was working as a dive instructor there were often times when I was leading a dive and it was clear that the clients had no clue how to use their dive computers to plan maximum safe bottom time, how to figure out in advance what the minimum amount of gas they needed to get back to the surface safely if they had to do any kind of safety stops on the way up, especially if sharing gas with their buddy, or how to use a compass to navigate back to the boat. They were basically betting their lives that I knew how to do that stuff. I concluded then that I wanted to avoid situations where I didn't understand the safety procedures and was completely reliant on someone else to keep me alive.
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Re: This is kind of disturbing.

Postby ExcitableBoy » Thu May 31, 2012 11:18 pm

philoparts wrote:BCA Float pack,

These devices have been in use in Europe for about 20 years so there is a lot of statistics regarding survivability during avalanches with these things. Turns out they improve you chances of survival by something like 3%. That woman who is sponsored by BCA and was in the party BC skiing at Steven's Pass who were buried in an avallanche did a huge disservice by making such strong statements about how great these devices are. In reality she was really super lucky the bags weren't shredded by trees and she buried like everyone else.
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