I actually went back myself in December and had no problems at all doing it solo. Maybe I was just in better hiking shape and heat was not a factor the 2nd time around? But there was also a group I ran into that was kind of dinking around at the crux and one dude stayed behind. I still think it is stiffer than the class 3 stuff I did in CO. And I agree with Moapa, the loose stuff is a lot more nerve wrecking.

What have you done in CO?

My experience is that class rating "stiffness" is indirectly proportional to popularity everywhere.

The CO 14ers standard routes are very popular, easy to follow, and generally a half to full grade soft relative to the less popular routes in CO or other states with less peak traffic. The less popular CO routes are rated closer to the mark.

Monster5 wrote:What have you done in CO?

Sawtooth and Father Dyer

Over time, people work out the harder parts of a route, so one can often see slight wear on the easiest handholds, or cairned paths around the iffiest sections. Colorado gets a lot more bad weather than the Sierra or desert SW, and that probably factors in. It's like those signs for suggested speed on highway curves... 35 mph may seem ludicrously slow in dry weather, but during a rainstorm...

Not too long ago, some guy died in that chute on Browns. I can easily see how that could happen. The rock was polished and slick in places, and I set off a foot-long boulder simply by stepping on the loose rocks a foot away.

I've done Browns a few times, and each time was a different experience since I didn't end up on the exact same route each time. It was very exposed and sketchy occasionally, while other times the only concern was knocking rock loose on those below. Even in the same chute, there is a lot of variation depending on where in the chute you go.

In case folks don't know -- there is an "easier" brushy route down Browns, to east of the chute. You will find more information on it by contacting searching the COHP site.