Thanks...Standard Route on Frankenstein Cliffs is something I followed last winter as part of a class. Easy and fun...got to watch Kevin Mahoney climb that day, too, which was neat. I will post in all of those forums you mentioned. And, of course, if you want to meet up and climb (since you live near me), let me know.

fatdad wrote:Given where you live, before investing in a bunch of gear and going for it, I'd suggest taking a class or two. Go with a reputable guide, not the first chump they throw at you. I've seen some really lousy, inexperienced guides out there. You'll bump up your learning curve significantly and also get a good sampling of what kind of gear you like/don't like, etc., before you dump some serious coin for your set up.

Yes, ice climbing gear is insanely expensive. I have some of it, and will get the rest as time goes on. Like I said, I have taken classes--three to be exact--with three different guides. They were all fantastic teachers with their own styles. One of them told me stories of how he learned technical climbing--by trial and error. He didn't recommend it. Experiential learning is great, even when it is hazardous. As a student of both climbing and education, the responses on this thread have been great.

In the end, all I really need is someone who know what the f#*k they're doing to humor me and climb some s@*t with me.

Here are the books I promised to dig out. They're very different from each other, but liked the both + main reason for me to read these was to get more some mountaineering knowledge + to learn about best way to build the belay anchors / fluent changes of leader for multi-pitch climbs. Have to say though, that the best way of multi pitch belay anchors / fluent changes of leader wasn't really well covered in these (learned through experience, reading Will's and Dane's blogs, talking to others + thinking it through while writing an article about it). So here are the books:

1. Winter Skills by Andy Cunningham and Allen Fyffe, ISBN-10: 0-9541511-3-5, ISBN-13: 978-0-9541511-3-3
2. Ice & Mixed Climbing: Modern Technique by Will Gadd, ISBN-10: 0-89886-769-x, ISBN-13: 978-0-89886-769-5

Flattlander wrote:This is a question for ice climbers out there: How did you learn? How did you get to the point where you could go out and climb waterfalls and gullies? Classes? More experienced friends? Just doing it?

The reason I ask is that I started learning last winter by taking classes. It was great experience, and I learned a lot and climbed some cool stuff in a controlled environment, with a guide on the sharp end. Then winter ended. I'm now thinking about this upcoming winter and asking myself, "How the heck am I going to continue my ice climbing education? I have no friends who climb ice, and I still have a lot to learn."

As I think about what my next move should be, I'm interested in hearing your stories.

Ask kozman18 to take you climbing

Flattlander wrote:How did you learn?

I was too poor to afford the proper gear, so....

I got some 2-inch wide flat steel bars in a junkyard and sawed them down to fit between my flexible boots and flexible crampons.

Voilà! Rigid ice-climbing gear.

Then I went to the ice and just started "bouldering" around the base of the frozen waterfalls.