Welcome to SP!  -
Areas & RangesMountains & RocksRoutesImagesArticlesTrip ReportsGearOtherPeoplePlans & PartnersWhat's NewForum

Changes to Voting System

Suggestions and comments about SummitPost's features, policies, and procedures. Post bugs here.
 

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby Montana Matt » Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:36 pm

Scott wrote:Don't forget about the media either. I would guess that most of the hits on my Bluejohn Canyon page (which if it weren't for the accident/movie would be a very obscure page) and photos were due to the movie 127 Hours and several news stories. Every time there's an accident, movie, news story, avalanche, or whatever, hits will go way up on whatever page.

Good points. A lot of us in Colorado link different pages through 14ers.com (a high traffic site), to answer questions, when someone is looking for beta on XX mountain. When someone ask for information on "Mount Powell" (for example) or something, it's easier to just post the SP link.

Right, but the plan was to only count hits for LOGGED IN users. Search engine traffic and traffic coming from 14ers.com isn't going to likely have many SP members who are logged into their account coming to the page that way.
Scott wrote:I guess the voting system doesn't need to be over complicated.

Agreed. I think the current (new) solution is good enough for the time being. Let's see how it goes for a while with it and then address any problems as they arise.
User Avatar
Montana Matt
Site Admin
 
Posts: 1108
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2004 10:06 pm
Location: Ashland, Oregon, United States
Thanked: 335 times in 181 posts

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby Bob Sihler » Sat Jan 19, 2013 10:39 pm

Bob Sihler wrote:
I am almost certain that currently only the owner gets the points. Everyone else gets zero. I've been admin on pages and given the rights to others, and the admins never saw point totals increase. I can definitely tell that the owner doesn't get partial points.


I am almost positive this is correct. It may have been different back when, though.

There is an easy way to test. I have a dummy account that I used to use for working on pages under the radar (never used for voting or trolling). I will give admin privs to it for some of my pages and see if there are any point changes tomorrow.

I agree that co-maintainers should split points.


No points for my admin-privileged avatar.
"Some men just want to watch the world burn."
User Avatar
Bob Sihler
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 7123
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 3:20 pm
Location: Herndon, Virginia
Thanked: 1683 times in 962 posts

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby Fred Spicker » Sun Jan 20, 2013 2:05 am

For a while, admin was like "co-owner" and received half of the points.

Then, it changed without notice or explanation.

I would like to see it possible to co-own pages once again.
User Avatar
Fred Spicker

 
Posts: 1276
Joined: Thu Jul 25, 2002 5:47 am
Location: Spokane, Washington, United States
Thanked: 50 times in 29 posts

The following user would like to thank Fred Spicker for this post
Matt Lemke, yatsek

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby Sarah Simon » Thu Jan 24, 2013 5:14 am

Do we have an estimated "Go Live" date for the voting changes? I've largely been abstaining from voting awaiting the new system...and hoping we see more honest/realistic voting and better/more granular use of the entire scale.
Go climb a mountain
User Avatar
Sarah Simon

 
Posts: 932
Joined: Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:01 am
Location: Black Forest, Colorado, United States
Thanked: 236 times in 105 posts

The following user would like to thank Sarah Simon for this post
lcarreau, mrchad9

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby mrchad9 » Thu Jan 24, 2013 5:19 am

Sarah you should probably still give my recent pages a 10/10. Better than doing nothing.
User Avatar
mrchad9

 
Posts: 4116
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:01 am
Location: San Ramon, California, United States
Thanked: 1187 times in 800 posts

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby Josh Lewis » Thu Jan 24, 2013 7:14 am

I assume it will be soon, but I don't know when. Tonight some folks looked at the new template to review the changes that will take place. It's almost finished, but there are a few additions that should be worked out. As you might know, we are trying to create as few angry folks as possible. :wink: Until a day or so ago the main menu was completely broken in IE8 and IE7! This is because they did not support the HTML5 tag "Nav". There were some other issues that needed to be addressed that are now fixed. In the web world us developers try hard at what we do with the little time that we have on our side.

Products typically have expected release dates. Why not SP? Because they set up everything way in advanced. They keep the news locked away from the public until everything is ready to go. In this case the news went public before there was any work done on the new template (not to discredit Matt for his optimizations he might have made before all this was known). This was to let folks know that something was being done and that Matt does care about the well being of SummitPost. I've had a lot of email conversations with him lately which it is very obvious to me that he cares about SP more than he's given credit.

Were doing what we can to make the changes as stable as possible before releasing the new version. We know some issues will arise right away (unfortunately). Some of them being changes needed to SP pages due to using deprecated code. But making this jump will ensure a better future for SP. Bad practices will some day catch up to us which is why we need to make the changes now rather than later. It's been an honor being apart of the project. Continue to vote appropriately on content and make change when the time is right. We've pumped a lot of hours into this and are quite eager ourselves to release this. 8)

But the important thing for both myself and everyone else is to be patient! I once heard "Good Things take Time. Great things happen all at once!"
My Websites: Alpine Josh · Alpine Ascent · AceMaps
User Avatar
Josh Lewis

 
Posts: 2191
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:12 pm
Location: Lynnwood, Washington, The Cloudiest Place on Earth, United States
Thanked: 437 times in 307 posts

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby Dow Williams » Thu Jan 24, 2013 4:28 pm

Montana Matt wrote:Right, but the plan was to only count hits for LOGGED IN users. Search engine traffic and traffic coming from 14ers.com isn't going to likely have many SP members who are logged into their account coming to the page that way.


I might have missed something, did not have time to go back and read the origin for this....but I disagree with this statement if in fact it is relating to what gets exposed on SP. Matt, currently the front page is full of nothing but tit for tat voting regarding photos. Which equals members "logged in" voting habits. In contrast, what you want are those photos that over time gain traction in Google for being news worthy or interesting or helpful...representing SP. That is a truly dynamic site, one void of club like behavior, inclusive, not exclusive to the few willing to spend time via tit for tat voting. That is the biggest complaint I get about SP in the field...it is stagnant and uninteresting....and why you see the same type of photos by the same characters over and over.

I do agree, using hits over votes is by far the best measure to what photos and beta pages should be displayed on the front....that would be a huge improvement to the site.
User Avatar
Dow Williams

 
Posts: 2349
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 1:59 pm
Location: Utah and Canadian Rockies
Thanked: 219 times in 101 posts

The following user would like to thank Dow Williams for this post
lcarreau, Montana Matt

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby mrchad9 » Thu Jan 24, 2013 4:42 pm

I think you make another good point Dow, that there is no incredible need for the photos on the front page to have been submitted in the last day or week. I think it is good if some are (as long as we can end the tit for tat games which predominate).

Matt is implementing photo of the moment soon, which I think will help. But as I think about the mechanism more I realize it won't solve all the problems. I know both Bob Sihler and Matt are interested in this just as you and I are, and I am continueing to discuss possibilities with them. Matt is working on conversion to SPv3 right now so we are going to wait and see what the impact of POTM is, and then continue with additional changes as we learn what worked and what didn't.

If you have specific ideas it would be good to lay them out. Sounds like chosing a random photo with the most hits in the last month that hasn't been on the front page yet? But hits can be manipulated too.

Personally I would like to see the featured beta pages given more structure. I think it is great they are changing more frequently now, but if there was an identifiable slot for a mountain page, a route page, a technical route, a new submission, a revamped page, etc... I think that would be well received.

With POTM I am trying to develop a mechanism that a photo like this can make the front page (which doesn't have many hit either BTW). We aren't there yet... but I hope we are on the way.

http://www.summitpost.org/arete-rochefo ... 0/c-324762

Image
User Avatar
mrchad9

 
Posts: 4116
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:01 am
Location: San Ramon, California, United States
Thanked: 1187 times in 800 posts

The following user would like to thank mrchad9 for this post
Josh Lewis

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby lcarreau » Thu Jan 24, 2013 6:14 pm

Not trying to open up a proverbial "can of worms," but just another example of how "whacked out" the present voting is :

my current photo of a prominent Arizona landform was nearly "beat out" by a dog ... yes, a dog !

Hey, not that I don't like dogs, but the last time I checked this was a MOUNTAIN and ROCKS site (?) .... :? ..... :?:
User Avatar
lcarreau

 
Posts: 4037
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:27 pm
Location: Court of the Crimson King, Arizona, United States
Thanked: 814 times in 614 posts

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby mrchad9 » Thu Jan 24, 2013 6:23 pm

You voted on the dog lcarreau. And commented on it. What are you complaining about?

You can't blame people for playing by the rules that they are given. We are all part of that process... we just need to develop the best set of rules so that site participation is maximized and good contributions are acknowledged. And I like seeing bits of members' personal lives in their photos!
User Avatar
mrchad9

 
Posts: 4116
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:01 am
Location: San Ramon, California, United States
Thanked: 1187 times in 800 posts

The following user would like to thank mrchad9 for this post
butitsadryheat, Montana Matt

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby butitsadryheat » Thu Jan 24, 2013 7:04 pm

Hits can be manipulated by software. This would casue it to be no better than "tit for tat" voting. Perhaps more votes come to those who are more pleasant and less condescending to others, therefore attracting more goodwill.

Just a thought.
User Avatar
butitsadryheat

 
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:59 pm
Location: Bakersfield, California, United States
Thanked: 1297 times in 942 posts

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby Sarah Simon » Thu Jan 24, 2013 7:47 pm

mrchad9 wrote:Sarah you should probably still give my recent pages a 10/10. Better than doing nothing.


If you'd post photos of your fine self instead of your little teddy bear, I might consider doing so... :twisted:
Go climb a mountain
User Avatar
Sarah Simon

 
Posts: 932
Joined: Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:01 am
Location: Black Forest, Colorado, United States
Thanked: 236 times in 105 posts

The following user would like to thank Sarah Simon for this post
lcarreau, Matt Lemke, Montana Matt

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby Vitaliy M. » Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:31 pm

If voters who vote are kept anonymous than people will care less about voting on particular people's photos, and might actually try to make sure they vote on the BEST photo to make it.
User Avatar
Vitaliy M.

 
Posts: 1008
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2011 1:23 am
Location: San Francisco, California, United States
Thanked: 287 times in 215 posts

The following user would like to thank Vitaliy M. for this post
lcarreau, Matt Lemke

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby lcarreau » Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:45 pm

mrchad9 wrote:You voted on the dog lcarreau. And commented on it. What are you complaining about?

You can't blame people for playing by the rules that they are given. We are all part of that process... we just need to develop the best set of rules so that site participation is maximized and good contributions are acknowledged. And I like seeing bits of members' personal lives in their photos!



Not denying that .... but don't have to be a Rocket Scientist to see how BROKEN the system is ... ANY CHANGE will be applauded as a positive one !!!

Vitaliy M. wrote:If voters who vote are kept anonymous than people will care less about voting on particular people's photos, and might actually try to make sure they vote on the BEST photo to make it.


Vitaliy has a very good point. Part of what's bogus with the current system.
Last edited by lcarreau on Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User Avatar
lcarreau

 
Posts: 4037
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 10:27 pm
Location: Court of the Crimson King, Arizona, United States
Thanked: 814 times in 614 posts

Re: Changes to Voting System

Postby mrchad9 » Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:47 pm

If votes were anonymous then I would vote 2/10 on all of Vitaliy's crappy ice climbing photos.
User Avatar
mrchad9

 
Posts: 4116
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:01 am
Location: San Ramon, California, United States
Thanked: 1187 times in 800 posts

PreviousNext

Return to Site Feedback

 


  • Related topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

© 2006-2013 SummitPost.org. All Rights Reserved.