I would bet that over half of the people reading this are using a crampon/boot combination that doesn't "fit".

Before you call, "bullshit", read on, then go check your own rig again.

What do I mean by "fit"? I mean ZERO movement between boot and crampon when latched and even more importantly when climbing.

If you can flex your crampons by holding your boot /crampon combo between your legs and pull up on the front points and have the crampon flex...they don't fit. If you can move the toe of your boot inside the front bail either before it is buckled in, after it is buckled in or the toe migrates inside the crampon off to the side once you are climbing, the crampon doesn't fit.

If you can move the connecting bar sideways while holding your boot and crampon combo, your crampon doesn't fit. If your crampon's heel section can be moved by pushing or pulling on the center bar, the crampon doesn't fit. It your replaceable front points have any flex in them left to right...you need to tighten the bolt that holds them to the crampon body. Not a fit issue..but you get the idea.

I own 5 pairs of boots from La Sportiva and Scarpa currently. And 6 pairs of technical crampons. The crampons are from Petzl, Black Diamond and Grivel. I mix and match heel pieces and toe bales on each brand to get the best fit possible. And still there are some crampon and boot combinations that imo I simply find unsuitable for technical climbing.

Petzl and Scarpa both claim in emails to me that the newest Phantom series of boots and the Dartwin and Dart combination is a "good combination with no issues". I've seen people who should know better claim a "perfect fit" between the same combo. I wear a size 45 boot and mine simply don't "fit".

I own those same boot and crampons and won't use the combinations myself because of the terrible boot to crampon interface. And I really like both the boots and the crampons.

Black Diamond knows there are issues with many of the newer super low profile boot soles and smaller boots in particular. None of the crampon manufactures have any control over what the boot manufactures come up with. But they must modify their crampons to fit. Easier said than done from my own experience. BD is currently working on a new bail design to better the fit on all the new boots.

Having a crampon that doesn't fit perfectly just makes the climbing harder. It makes the climbing less safe. Dropping a crampon can literally be a life or death issue. It is never a good thing.

Some where between now (2011) and then (1980) we have allowed the manufactures to produce and we keep buying, some really bad combos for crampon and boot interface.

Why do I care? Having a "proper" crampon fit makes climbing so much easier. The crampons simply work better on hard technical terrain, especially so on ice.

Do me a favor and let me know if your crampons actually "fit" or don't. The reason I ask? I was playing with my Spantik's last night and the crampons I prefer to use on them. You can guess what I found...but my thought was, "sacrebleu, these don't fit!". And now you know how I came up with 50%.

Dane,

I regularly read your blog and get lots of great information from it. But I question whether you are over thinking the crampon fit issue. I have two pair of boots and three pair of crampons and none of them would pass your "fit test." However I've never had a problem with a lost crampon or really see any need for a better fit. There are millions of combinations of boots (and sizes of boots) and crampons and neither manufacture can possibly be expected to create a perfect fit. Maybe we should open a business offering "custom" crampons specific for your boot?

As for the connector bar in crampons. I usually find that the best fit would be halfway between pre-existing holes and would take a lot of the slop out. Maybe that's the solution? A connector bar that has unlimited settings rather than 15 holes for adjustment.

I recognize that a perfect crampon would help transfer all of the kick energy into the ice rather than some small amount of energy being wasted due to improper crampon fit but this could be resolved with a true rigid crampon. I used DMM Terminators to cut my teeth on and it's incredible how much easier they are to climb with than the current gen. of semi-rigid crampons (basically everything on the market). It's a trade off I guess since rigids are a bitch to hike in.

I dunno. I got a new boot/crampon combo to try this weekend (Scarpa Phantom Guides and Darts). They don't fit perfect but I'll likely shred some ice regardless.

Good Post and very true.

Recently (last 10 years), many variations of boot soles resulted in too many combinations of flat crampons with curved boots etc. My 1980s flat rail, Chouinard rigid crampons with adjustable rails were great because all mountaineering boots (then) had flat and rigid sole. Those crampons, after adjustments fit extremely well.

These days, it is very difficult to find the correct combination, sometimes inpossible. In general, good fit for me is, the crampon rails are flat (close to the boot) and either contour the sole of the boot and/or can be adjusted to match the outline, the inside points match the outline of the boot, the front points protrude (at a minimum) 1 1/2 inch from under the toe and when you grab the front point and try to separate them from the boot, they are solid. Very few boot/crampon combinations can be found to fit well these days.

I tried G-14s on my 7 pairs of mountaineering boots, old and new, they would not fit (to my standard) on any of them. Returned the crampons. G-12, because they are more flexible, actually worked and fit better.

IMO, bring your boots to the store and don't buy the first pair of crampons just because it's convenient.

"I used DMM Terminators to cut my teeth on and it's incredible how much easier they are to climb with than the current gen. of semi-rigid crampons "

Exactly why I don't think...it is a small issue Most crampons aren't going to fall off these days. But fit? Most don't that I see.

Crampons were better for pure ice 30 years ago than they are today. How did that happen when the tools are light years ahead?

Amazing place here...but suspect
56% yes and 44% no on another thread.
Well over 50% no on another....
likely 60 yes /40 no on the third
and a lot more posting on any one of them than here.

why don't you put some pictures, so that we can better understand the issue.
"seeing is believing"

Dane,

What do you recommend as your "best fit" for the la sportiva spantiks (preferrably not a mix and match, but the next best thing)?

My crampons fell off in the middle of the canaleta (Aconcagua) and started jetting down the mountain. It was only a quick manuever with my ice axe that stopped them. I can't imagine what this would be like on a steeper more technical route.

Thanks!

chickentikka wrote:Dane,

What do you recommend as your "best fit" for the la sportiva spantiks (preferrably not a mix and match, but the next best thing)?

My crampons fell off in the middle of the canaleta (Aconcagua) and started jetting down the mountain. It was only a quick manuever with my ice axe that stopped them. I can't imagine what this would be like on a steeper more technical route.

Thanks!

Did you put the crampons on properly? I don't see how your crampons would pop loose like that. I've seen pictures of crampons popping out, but the strap would at least keep them on the boots.

Gee, I hope so. Otherwise I've been using them wrong for a long time. They got a little bit loose over a long day. Truth is, if I had just stopped to tighten them up a little bit it wouldn't have been an issue.

I have the Black Diamond ones, which they call CLIP, with the lace that goes over to the toe, then around to the loop on your inside heal then back over to the loop on the other side and then synches down.

The "pro" type that BD sells looks a bit sturdier. It clamps down to your toe welt