I'm not a big fan of snowmobiles either but mostly because of the morons here in CO who get in over their heads (and their Buddha bellies) and need rescue. I don't think matt's a moron. Can't speak to the Buddha belly.

Guess I don't see the difference between snowmobiling and cat-skiing, other than the latter tends to be limited to one area. And costs an arm and your left knacker. Kinda like heli-skiing as well. So shall we limit it all?

I like hella-skiing but I think heli-skiing should not be permitted in the Sierra.

DMT

It's just snowed 24" in the last 24hrs, still coming down, it's dark now and you're six miles from your car still. You stumble upon snowmobile tracks. Suddenly you are in love with the machines that formed these wintry roadways.

Even though I prefer snowshoes or XC skis and I hate the sound and smell of snowmobiles, they are also good for scaring the bears away (ask me how I know) and making the return trip back to the car easier. Lots of great riding in NorCal:

http://www.snowcrest.net/mssc/homea.html

It's just snowed 24" in the last 24hrs, still coming down, it's dark now and you're six miles from your car still. You stumble upon snowmobile tracks. Suddenly you are in love with the machines that formed these wintry roadways.

No thanks.

I'd prefer a midnight return or even a bivy than have any motorized impacts where I like to go, should I ever have planned so poorly. I like breaking trail and virgin snow, no matter how bad it gets. Of course, I'd rather have my toes and legs in an emergency, but more likely a helicopter for that.

I have a friend who was stuck on Mt Baker in a storm for 3 nights -- an unplanned bivy, when about 10' of snow fell (they had to keep digging out the cave entrance from the inside). When they finally emerged into sunshine on the 4th day, they were weak and stumbled downhill, almost giving up... into a group of snowmobilers who were genteel and and took them out. He softened his stance on snowmobiles after that.

On the other hand, the snowmobilers on the back of Sandia Peak would constantly leave the permitted trails, and turn the X-C ski trails into hard-packed irregular chutes. Often they would just stop to eat lunch in the trail, at the bottom of a long downhill. I would picture myself in a James Bond movie, skiing with an uzi at ready.

1000Pks wrote:No thanks.

I'd prefer a midnight return or even a bivy than have any motorized impacts where I like to go, should I ever have planned so poorly.

Me thinks you misunderstood. We didn't get rides on snowmobiles, but we availed ourselves of the nice packed tracks they'd left behind.

Bob funny story

Burl and I went to Cold Stream up in Truckee to go ice climbing. Cold Stream is located in that giant Horseshoe Bend section of Union Pacific railroad tracks just south of Donner lake area

Its a major snowmobile area as it is mostly private land back there with lots of cabins etc.

So there was lots of snow on the ground but it had been many days since last storm

WE drove up the road in my jeep and got to where the snow machine trailhead as it were

It was so well packed I said to Burl - "I'm gonna keep going!"

So we did. We drove up the snow machine tracks all the way to the underpass under the railroad. it was choked with ice and water and I said FCUK IT and blasted through the tunnel too.

That put us pretty much in walking distance to Cold Stream but I kept going anyway. We got to within a half mile of the place before I chickened out and stopped.

Coming out we got the damnedest looks! Especially when we crashed back through the tunnel again (had to hit it as SPEED)

DMT

Same thing happened to me. Was up at Mt. Bailey in Oregon one time and didn't feel like skinning the first few miles.
The road in was a snowmachine packed road. I wasn't sure if I would sink in or not.
The snow was about 6-7 feet deep.
I decided to go for it.




Saved me some seriously cold few miles.

...With all due respect, and I'm guilty of a few ethical lapses myself, I'm beginning to think that (some) members of the younger generation do not understand the basic rules of the game. Or even understand the game itself. You plan your trip carefully...then you take your chances. And if you want a mechanized lift up a ski slope, go to a commercial ski resort. Don't have time for the hike in? Then plan shorter trips. That's just my opinion.

Yeah, I've known guys who ferry themselves in on a dirt bike, making back and forth trips over muddy or snowy closed roads. But then the dirt bike stays put and does not enter the true BC.

C'mon, where are the old trads on this issue? What's next, a snowmobile race up to Iceberg Lake or Lamarck Col?

~~steve

No motorized anything in wilderness areas IMO and I include power drills, park service chain saws, and anything with a gas engine on it.

Cut and dried. I would like to have an inexpensive show machine for the roadhead east side approaches though, I must admit.

I've seen high pointing on the peaks around Sonora Pass... those cockwads need to be arrested.

DMT

Me thinks you misunderstood. We didn't get rides on snowmobiles, but we availed ourselves of the nice packed tracks they'd left behind.

Nope. Never said anything of the sort.

Obviously you can glide 10x or more faster on a prepared track versus deep powder, but that's not what I go for. By the MLC SC and others, there should be trams, roads, escalators, or what to get to the top of a mountain. While I did ride the train to the top of Pikes Peak, I myself would probably not do much of what I do if such were the case for all of the peaks that I climb. I like exercise, challenge, natural scenic beauty, etc. I will never evermore drive to the top of Diablo, Tam, etc., maybe even hiking, too, due to the crowds, bad vibes, pollution, trash, etc., most likely, as long as I can travel. I wish no such fate for the hundreds of other peaks I do; it's surprising that you should consider the opposing view with all of your efforts.

That "it's not fair," by the MLC SC, that they have to hike, is, I'll admit, part of what keeps me going. When I summit, none of them will be there!

HandjamMasterC wrote:Forget the skis altogether. Now I'm thinking of buying a snowmobile, building some snowmen up there and doing some " drive by biathalon " shooting with semi autos !!

OMG! That thing's propeller driven! That's sweet!

I don't like snowmobilers in the backcountry. They're loud and smelly. That being said, if I see a track when I'm cross -country sking I'll step in it ever time.
If snowmobilers come into the NP that I patrol... well I'll get on the radio and call the rangers who will dispatch The CHP helicopter. Courts, fines and confiscation may insue.

Bob Burd wrote:It's just snowed 24" in the last 24hrs, still coming down, it's dark now and you're six miles from your car still. You stumble upon snowmobile tracks. Suddenly you are in love with the machines that formed these wintry roadways.

Aw, man. NICE!!!