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Testosterone.

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Testosterone.

Postby Marmaduke » Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:12 am

In light of recent baseball players being banned and now Lance Armstrong being back in the news for banned substances. Regarding the current great climbers and alpinists, would it matter to anyone if these people were using the stuff? Years ago it was a known fact and I guess even OK with climbers that meth and the like were used during climbs. What 's your opinion?
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby Marmaduke » Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:37 am

But what if some of the current speed records up certain walls or an alpine climb that is faster than ever. Wouldn't climbers be negative on that, regardless if there isn't a governing body overseeing the "sport"?
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby Catamount » Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:00 pm

I think the big difference is that there is no money involving in hiking, mountaineering or trad climbing. Most sports are strictly governed because doping could make the difference between being a minor league ball player barely paying the bills and a major league all-star with eight cars and three houses. In climbing, there are only a few with sponsorships and everyone else is paying their own way. If you're going for a speed record and are doping/taking drugs to do it, well I think you'd risk the ridicule of the local community if you were found it and that seems to be punishment enough.

Having said that, maybe I should be stripped of a handful of state highpoints as being Diamox-aided. :?
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby Vitaliy M. » Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:20 pm

I think the big difference is that there is no money involving in hiking, mountaineering or trad climbing.


LOL You think pro climbers are able to be pro climbers just because they have a big trust? Who do you think pays for all the trips all over the world. There is sponsorship money in trad climbing/sport climbing/bouldering/alpinism etc.

maybe I should be stripped of a handful of state highpoints as being Diamox-aided.


Shouldn't be stripped, you been up them. But should not feel too satisfied with your effort. But than again, whatever swings your boat. For me mountaineering/climbing is about self challenge/exploration of different parts of the world, not just getting to the high point of some peak.
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby sharperblue » Fri Aug 24, 2012 8:27 pm

The whole concept - in climbing or anything else - is a slippery slope: does caffeine count? it's an amphetamine. My own take is that it doesn't matter, In climbing, you're expressing/exploring ways to know yourself or overcome your own limitations, whether physically or mentally. How you do this (or fail to do so) is a battle that is all your own, and so are the rules.
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby Catamount » Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:07 pm

Vitaliy M. wrote:
LOL You think pro climbers are able to be pro climbers just because they have a big trust? Who do you think pays for all the trips all over the world. There is sponsorship money in trad climbing/sport climbing/bouldering/alpinism


Yes and I acknowledged that in my first post. The best mountaineers get sponsorship money but not anything close to what you see in professional sports ... there's no real comparison. Guys like Conrad Anker and Ed Viesturs have big bucks from book deals, guiding and speaking gigs etc, not prize money or multi-million dollar contracts.

And the last part of my first post was completely tongue-in-cheek, but thanks for judging my pursuits.
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby Vitaliy M. » Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:16 pm

Yea, but if there is sponsorships/contracts for top climbers, than there would be competition to be a top climber. And I can totally see how someone would want to get the edge by taking something they shouldn't (in ideal world). Sometimes however I think people should be allowed to take whatever they want. It is their body, if they are willing to deal with all the adverse effects of roids etc than who am I to tell them they shouldn't do it? Personally, I can care less what others think I do. Only live once.
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby butitsadryheat » Sat Aug 25, 2012 12:03 am

sharperblue wrote:The whole concept - in climbing or anything else - is a slippery slope: does caffeine count? it's an amphetamine.


While both caffeine and meth are both stimulants, caffeine is NOT an amphetamine.
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby sharperblue » Sat Aug 25, 2012 12:28 am

butitsadryheat wrote:
sharperblue wrote:The whole concept - in climbing or anything else - is a slippery slope: does caffeine count? it's an amphetamine.


While both caffeine and meth are both stimulants, caffeine is NOT an amphetamine.


that's true - stimulant - i stand corrected.
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby lcarreau » Sat Aug 25, 2012 1:30 am

sharperblue wrote:
that's true - stimulant - i stand corrected.


I could use a "stimulant" right now ..

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Re: Testosterone.

Postby Toxic » Sat Aug 25, 2012 5:07 am

butitsadryheat wrote:
sharperblue wrote:The whole concept - in climbing or anything else - is a slippery slope: does caffeine count? it's an amphetamine.


While both caffeine and meth are both stimulants, caffeine is NOT an amphetamine.


Yeah, that was lulz to the max when I saw it earlier today on my phone but I was too busy with science to respond.

How come most SP members are at the knowledge level of medieval serfs? Wait a second, maybe this website is a time portal to the Medieval Ages! DUN DUN DUUUUUNNNNN!
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby lcarreau » Sat Aug 25, 2012 5:20 am

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Re: Testosterone.

Postby Andrew Rankine » Sat Aug 25, 2012 5:54 am

borutbk wrote:Luckily (?), climbing, alpinism is not a sport. If it was, it would matter.
Hermann Buhl already describes (with satisfaction) his use of amphs (Nanga Parbat). But I'm quite sure most climbs nowadays are clean. Drugs are lighter weight than alcohol, and I guess that is a factor.


I think climbing and alpinism are both sports (rock climbing may be in the 2020 Olympics, also), but not in the sense of competition, money and powerful governing bodies. For heavy amphetamines, it would not be practical because one needs be able to think clearly (don't want to end up like Tom Simpson in the 1967 Tour de France).
I have wondered why one would not dope their blood at high altitude. As a cyclist I object to it, but for 8000 m peaks, it seems practical on summit days.
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Re: Testosterone.

Postby Ben Beckerich » Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:22 am

Nope.. other peoples' climbing doesn't interest me, beyond beta for my own.
where am i going... and why am i in this handbasket?
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