Hey everyone. I've been doing some research on the Tatras, some on this website and based on what I've read I need some guidance.

First my experience:

A proficient scrambler, partnered climber and solo hiker. My previous solo "expeditions" are several 1-2 week stints in Snowdonia, the Lake District and Glen Coe (Ben Nevis area). In terms of international experience, I spent 2 weeks of late Summer (June/July) in the Bavarian Alps, namely Zugspitze and the Allgau area.

My winter experience is limited to single day outs in Snowdonia.

Now why I'm here:

It's been 3 years since I returned from Bavaria, and I have been pining for the mountains since. I tend to save my "holidays" until my birthday, as it's a great excuse to leave the country for a couple of weeks. This year, with my recent interest in Eastern Europe (namely Poland) I've chosen to visit the Tatra's mountains. I originally perceived it would be relatively complication free, with the difficulty only correlating to weather and the topography. However some research has led me to believe I will be dealing with a lot of red tape, an inability to Wild camp, and inability to trek without a guide. In Bavaria you could essentially do anything you want; I slept in a sleeping bag at 2000m, then did the same the next night but at the bottom of the trail right next to the path, and I pitched a tent 100m from a road in the trees so this is an entirely new thing to me.

My plan is to fly to Krakow on the 19th October, camp there for a day or two at a registered site. Do some food shopping, gather my wits and take in some of the architecture. Obviously this presents no problems, just your basic tourist stuff. Next I would be heading south, hit the Tatra's and bag as many peaks as I can (taking into consideration I have no technical equipment beyond Crampons and and Ice axe), including Rysy and Gerlachovský štít. On nights I will be whipping out a Bivvy bag, for a natural rise and continue off on my journey. I'll exit the Tatra's on the South end, head to Bratislava and either return to the UK from there or back at Krakow depending on circumstances, on the 2nd Nov.

Cliffs:

-Travelling from UK
-Solo hiking/scrambling in Tatra mountains in a month
-On my own and for 2 weeks
-Low budget, so want to bivvy for the majority of the time as a result. Also not paying for a guide, which is apparently frowned upon.
-No technical climbing gear
-Want to bag as many peaks as possible, including Rysy and Gerlach


Some points that you can probably enlighten me on-

1. Gerlachovsky doesn't seem a possibility based on research, ostensibly it requires climbing gear. Is this correct?
2. How accessible are the peaks generally? I am aware there is a lot of via verrata on the routes.
3. I like to Wild camp because it makes the whole experience more natural, it's cheaper (I am not exactly a high earner) and it means I can just pack up and go. In Bavaria I took a tent, but spent a few days just in my sleeping bag and I'd like to skip pitching and de-pitching during my stay. However based on reading this will be a MAJOR ISSUE. I don't want to have to drop a large proportion of my funds on accommodation, one of the main benefits of mountaineering trips is not having to spend upwards of £500 on a hotel (money which can be used for sustenance/extra gear).

Thank you for all of your responses.

Edit: If it helps I am a member of the BMC, I have read previously presenting a card benefits you in terms of accessibility.

1. Gerlachovsky doesn't seem a possibility based on research, ostensibly it requires climbing gear. Is this correct?

It requires climbing gear if you wish to do it legally. However, the easiest route is a light scramble. Just don't get caught by the guides or the park rangers.

2. How accessible are the peaks generally? I am aware there is a lot of via verrata on the routes.

Polish side: very accessible. Slovak side, except for a few, not so much. The Slovaks take a different approach, they try to limit the sort of mass tourism to certain areas and keep the rest off-limits for everyone who isn't a climber (where your BMC card comes in handy - plead ignorance if you end up breaking any rules) or has a reason to be there. The (much smaller) Polish side is literally littered with trails going nearly anywhere. In Poland, however, if you get caught doing something you're not supposed to, fines are upwards from PLN 500,- (100 GBP) and they'll dish them out like candy, where in Slovakia you're far more likely to get away with a warning or a €5,- fine.

3. I like to Wild camp because it makes the whole experience more natural, it's cheaper (I am not exactly a high earner) and it means I can just pack up and go. In Bavaria I took a tent, but spent a few days just in my sleeping bag and I'd like to skip pitching and de-pitching during my stay. However based on reading this will be a MAJOR ISSUE. I don't want to have to drop a large proportion of my funds on accommodation, one of the main benefits of mountaineering trips is not having to spend upwards of £500 on a hotel (money which can be used for sustenance/extra gear).

Wild camping in TPN (Poland) will be a major issue, and unless you have a good reason for it (think emergency bivvy in inclement weather) will get you a minimum fine of 500 złotych. The fact that the Polish side is so accessible also means that it's very accessible for rangers who can fine you. There are also like 8 or 9 mountain huts, most of which have campgrounds where you pay fuck all to pitch a tent and can use the facilities offered by the hut.
Wild camping in TANAP (Slovakia) is far easier, although still illegal, because it's much bigger, and there are far more remote places where anyone hardly ever comes. Stay at least a kilometre away from mountain huts and you should be fine. If you do end up getting caught, you might just want to whip out your BMC card and a map and show them some route you were interested in nearby, and they'll be unlikely to throw the book at you.

Having said all of this, staying in a hut will only cost you around 10 GBP per night in this part of the world, and you get your creature comforts without having to worry about park wardens or mountain guides (which are allowed to fine you on the spot in Slovakia). In Poland it's definitely not worth the hassle of risking a fine 10 times the amount of sleeping a night in the hut, especially as it's nearly impossible to get more than an hour or two away from the nearest hut in the Polish High Tatra. (Western Tatra is slightly sparser). In Slovakia I can see the benefits for camping somewhere high in a corrie to get an early start up a peak as the huts are much sparser and a good two-thirds of all valleys don't even have trails in them.

As for your other concerns, the reason why TPN in Poland is so restricted is because they need to deal with 5 to 7 million annual visitors of which few have spent more than three days in their lives in the mountains and even less have any sort of mountaineering experience, and most only come down to go a few nights on the piss and tell their friends they've been to Tatry while they've hardly left the hut. Of course, the sheer amount of people that never set foot on any mountain and then decide that they wish to climb Rysy from the (more difficult) Polish side on flipflops from Morskie Oko and need mountain rescue becasue they can't get down anymore causes massive headaches to everyone involved in the day to day business of TPN.

Think Ben Nevis in Scotland, and what sort of appeal it has on people from all over the British Isles to become a statistic. Now multiply the amount of infrastructure in place by ten, and divide the amount of miles separating Ben Nevis from the major British population centres by four. That should give you an idea... The place would be trashed by now and TOPR could set up scheduled services with their helicopter.
Anywhere in Poland outside Tatry, you can do pretty much whatever you want and no one loses any sleep over it. Neither would anyone care about you trekking through the mountains without a guide as long as you stick to the trails and don't wild camp because you want to save money. (as mentioned before, you're more likely to get away with it in Slovakia if it would make your ascent up a peak less of a pain)

Tatra is probably the most visited (as in tourists per square kilometre) and the most developed (as in kilometres of trail and amount of huts per square kilometre) higher mountain range in Europe. Add to that that it's a UNESCO Biosphere reserve and that it's a major part of the Natura2000 ecological network, you can see why, unfortunately, the regulations, especially on the Polish side, are necessary.

expedition in Snowdonia reminds me of the expedition movie of the garage

Stefan wrote:expedition in Snowdonia reminds me of the expedition movie of the garage

Well, Snowdonia National Park is with 2,132 km2 more than twice as big as Slovakian and Polish Tatry combined (950 km2)

Snowdonia also gets less visitors... I guess from that perspective it can seem like an expedition compared to Tatry. Or Tatry can be seen as a city park featuring a range of mountains...

Proterra wrote:

Stefan wrote:expedition in Snowdonia reminds me of the expedition movie of the garage

Well, Snowdonia National Park is with 2,132 km2 more than twice as big as Slovakian and Polish Tatry combined (950 km2)

Snowdonia also gets less visitors... I guess from that perspective it can seem like an expedition compared to Tatry. Or Tatry can be seen as a city park featuring a range of mountains...

Stop drinking

So ... What you wanne do in Tatra? Why Tatra?

Hey everyone, I thought I would post an update on the trip.

I had an amazing time! In fact I enjoyed myself so much, I went there again this January. But for a different reason. Will elaborate:

-At first I had bad time due to a large amount of fatigue, the weather was overcast or raining, and I couldn't communicate with anyone in Zakopane (leading to a lot of frustrated locals trying to welcome me). But after resting at a B&B, focusing a day on just relaxing in Zakopane, trying some of the local cuisine and studying up on Polish I really enjoyed myself.

-The following day I went into the mountains. I had no problems sleeping, if you understand. Next day I went up my first peak, and due to my large pack I was caught up by none other than 2 Polish girls. They let me stay at their accommodation, I became friends with them and two other girls who were back at the same cabin. The next 2 weeks were a combination of spending time with these girls, spending 5 days in the mountains alone (scaling a couple of peaks in the process, but failing on Rysy because there was too much snow in the gully (I tried to crampon up but the snow was unsuitable once it got too steep and deep). After that I returned back to Zakopane and went to Krakow 2 days later I finish off my trip.

The reason why I went back in January was to visit my new friends, and I am planning to move there soon.

Thanks for your responses, there was far less complications than I anticipated and when I live there I will be popping into the Tatry many, many times.