The vanishing Snows of Kilimanjaro

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Buz Groshong

 
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by Buz Groshong » Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:55 pm

outofstep80 wrote:I actually am a global warming believer. I think both sides have there extremes though. It is definitely a complex system that we are trying to analyze and it is difficult to know the extent of the damage we have caused, but to think that everything we do has no impact is more than a little...(fill in the blank)


You know, I guess since this isn't PnP, we'll allow you to be reasonable. :D

That's actually the way I see it. We can't predict the weather a week ahead, so while we can observe a trend and possibly predict that it will continue, we really can't predict its magnitude very accurately. But yes, everything we do has consequences and we have certainly increased substantially the output of CO2 to the atmosphere. We have also released halocarbon gasses into the atmosphere that are breaking down the ionospheric ozone.

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sopwith21

 
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NOTE TO MODERATOR

by sopwith21 » Sat Nov 21, 2009 8:39 pm

NOTE TO MODERATOR:

A news report on a new finding that Himalayan glaciers were not, in fact, melting was banished to PnP.

Why is this thread, which takes the opposite position, considered legitimate "news" and left here in the news section?

It doesn't matter which way we go, but let's be consistent. If we're to banish environmental news to PnP, let's banish ALL environmental threads equally.

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MoapaPk

 
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by MoapaPk » Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:34 pm

This thread stayed fairly civil, and most people did seem to read the cited article a bit more carefully after the dual interpretations were mentioned. The other thread seemed to be raising emotions, and was quickly spinning off into heated rhetoric.

The middle-of-the-road is a dangerous place... you get hit by cars going both directions!

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The Chief

 
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by The Chief » Sun Nov 22, 2009 12:38 am

What is more, he suggested that the recent melting had more to do with a decline in moisture levels than with a warming atmosphere.

“Our understanding is that it is due to the slow drying out of ice,” Dr. Kaser said. “It’s about moisture fluctuation.”


Imagine that, the lack of precip and not actual warming is the primary cause.

Maybe someone should tell Gore.

As MoapaPk stated, maybe the AGW close minded religous Thumpers should actually read the recent peer reviewed study.... duh.

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Alpinist

 
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by Alpinist » Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:03 pm

I don't doubt that a reduction in percipitation is a major factor in the glacier melt on Kilimanjaro. However, that does not in any way disprove global warming.

The majority of glaciers on this planet are melting. Unless you can prove that they are all melting because of a lack of percipitation, then the fact that the glacier on Kili is melting because of it means nothing in the context of the global warming debate.

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MoapaPk

 
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by MoapaPk » Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:20 pm

Alpinist wrote:I don't doubt that a reduction in percipitation is a major factor in the glacier melt on Kilimanjaro. However, that does not in any way disprove global warming.

The majority of glaciers on this planet are melting. Unless you can prove that they are all melting because of a lack of percipitation, then the fact that the glacier on Kili is melting because of it means nothing in the context of the global warming debate.


I think one of the points of the article(s) was that people should be cautious in using Kili as a "poster child"; there are much better (less ambiguous) examples of glaciers melting from temperature change.

EDIT: The ties between GW and glacial advance/retreat are really very complicated:
http://www.scientificblogging.com/news_ ... al_warming

I think it is fairly dangerous, no matter what side of the debate you are on, to draw simple conclusions. There are glaciers that are "advancing" rapidly, but are actually decreasing in total mass, since they now have a more slippery bottom layer and are accelerating and thinning as they move to the sea.
Last edited by MoapaPk on Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Mihai Tanase

 
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by Mihai Tanase » Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:22 pm

MoapaPk wrote:The middle-of-the-road is a dangerous place... you get hit by cars going both directions!

Excellent!

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sopwith21

 
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by sopwith21 » Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:03 pm

MoapaPk wrote:This thread stayed fairly civil, and most people did seem to read the cited article a bit more carefully after the dual interpretations were mentioned. The other thread seemed to be raising emotions, and was quickly spinning off into heated rhetoric.

You're discussing WHY two threads on the same topic are treated in an inconsistent, contradictory fashion (and you could be quite correct). I'm merely observing THAT two threads on the same topic are treated in an inconsistent, contradictory fashion.

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Day Hiker

 
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by Day Hiker » Mon Nov 23, 2009 7:11 am

sopwith21 wrote:
MoapaPk wrote:This thread stayed fairly civil, and most people did seem to read the cited article a bit more carefully after the dual interpretations were mentioned. The other thread seemed to be raising emotions, and was quickly spinning off into heated rhetoric.

You're discussing WHY two threads on the same topic are treated in an inconsistent, contradictory fashion (and you could be quite correct). I'm merely observing THAT two threads on the same topic are treated in an inconsistent, contradictory fashion.


Just a hunch, and the site's admin can verify, but I don't think the other thread was moved because of TOPIC.

OMG....What the fuck are you talking about?

Wow ...you really do know it all. The massive consensus of scientists all around the world means nothing to you. Does it suck being that good or can you deal with it because you are just that fucking cool?
Maybe someday if I spray enough on SP I too can reach your level of awesomness.
Until then I'll just stick with trolling...

You fucking hypocrite.
Asshole.
you're just another gym-climbing loud mouthed n00b.

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MoapaPk

 
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by MoapaPk » Mon Nov 23, 2009 3:01 pm


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sopwith21

 
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by sopwith21 » Thu Nov 26, 2009 5:45 am

Day Hiker wrote:Just a hunch, and the site's admin can verify, but I don't think the other thread was moved because of TOPIC.

Moderators become puppets when they allow deliberately posted profanity to manipulate them into moving a news story PnP. That's why they have the ability to delete individual posts.

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WouterB

 
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by WouterB » Thu Nov 26, 2009 10:38 am

sopwith21 wrote:
Day Hiker wrote:Just a hunch, and the site's admin can verify, but I don't think the other thread was moved because of TOPIC.

Moderators become puppets when they allow deliberately posted profanity to manipulate them into moving a news story PnP. That's why they have the ability to delete individual posts.

+1.006


Why can't the Tanzanian government just hire the Chinese to change the weather for them?

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MoapaPk

 
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by MoapaPk » Thu Nov 26, 2009 4:14 pm

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

Turkeys against climate change



I ran out of apostrophes.

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lowlands

 
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by lowlands » Sat Dec 12, 2009 11:24 pm

I hope I get to climb Kili before all of the snow is gone.

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Jasonak

 
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Re: The vanishing Snows of Kilimanjaro

by Jasonak » Tue Sep 04, 2012 5:14 am


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