I don't know much about ice climbing but I did enjoy living in GJ alot. The mountain biking is world class and the location is close to sooo much including Moab (where I did not like the mountain biking). I met alot of great people and made good friends. It has some drawbacks but for me they were insignificant.

Seano has some great pictures of ice climbing in Ouray
http://drdirtbag.wordpress.com

Well It was ten years ago and the place has grown so much since then but I just felt a little distant from the modern world and current events and styles. There was plenty of progressive thought in the crowd I fell into though. I did miss cultural diversity as well, although there were some decent international food choices at the time. I remember driving to Vegas after being in GJ for a while and being reminded of the goods and bads of a larger city.

Shane R. wrote:I've never been to Colorado. How are these places? I've heard negative things about Grand Junc.

What were some of the things you heard about GJ?

Nah, it was gorgeous. On one side there is the Grand Mesa, on the other the Colorado Natl. Monument and a whole lotta beautiful sky in between. I did notice the agricultural influence like the fresh produce for sale but none of the negatives. Perhaps if you lived close to a farm but they are far enough from the town.

I would say skip Denver, it is too far from anything and has the big city headaches without many of the advantages.

One thing I can say you may miss is some of that beer that is made over there in California, oh man there's nothin like a cali IPA!

Oh and if you don't have four wheel drive I would say getting over that pass from Durango might be an issue and worth looking into. I would say it might be easier in winter from the north.

As far as jobs in your field, I would look at Springs. Solid opportunities in IT/Tech type positions there. It is however quite a drive from Springs to the San Juans. (Ouray) The Western Slope is beautiful and GJ is nice despite what you may have heard and would be much closer. You might have to be patient in your search for a tech position in a small community but it is not unheard of. Developement really might be tough outside a decent size city though. Good luck man!

Shane R. wrote:Could I get away without a 4x4 living on the Western Slope?

Sure, but you're going to spend a lot of time sitting at home. (:

The western slope would be a beautiful place to live....

Shane R. wrote:I'm an aspiring alpinist.

If you want to go ice cragging then Colorado is not a bad place. Same with New Hampshire. If you want to learn to be an alpinist there are better choices since Colorado has no real alpine climbing to speak of. If you want both reliable waterfall climbing and genuine alpine climbing Calgary, Bozeman, and Jackson Hole are better choices. The best alpinists I know spend a lot of time climbing frozen waterfalls in the Canadian Rockies. Another idea is to move to Chamonix for a couple of years on a student visa where you will have ample ice and alpine climbing opportunities.

If you want to stay in the tech field, Seattle has a strong market for tech jobs and has the only genuine alpine climbing in the lower 48. The waterfall climbing in Washington is emphemeral but Seattle is close enough to reliable ice in BC, Canada for weekend ice climbing trips. The Canadian Rockies, Hyalite, and Cody are all within a long day's drive so week long climbing trips are very doable.

Shane R. wrote:

ExcitableBoy wrote:If you want to stay in the tech field, Seattle has a strong market for tech jobs and has the only genuine alpine climbing in the lower 48.

By alpine climbing, do you mean mixed rock and ice? I consider much of the climbing in the Sierra, "alpine climbing". This is why I ask.

What I mean by 'alpine climbing' is those ranges that have the same characteristics as the European Alps where alpine climbing was born. Those characteristics including the following:

[list=]Expansive glaciers
Tall mountains
Steep routes
Rock, ice, and mixed routes[/list]

Obviously my interpretation of 'Alpine' is open to exception and argument but that is the way I see it.

Shane Rathbun wrote:

knoback wrote:the 'proj' is not the best resource for ice/alpine outside CO. Neither is this place, but we're working on it.

I realize that.

However, looking at Mountain Project/SP is a start. And when you're looking at a place like Montana which has three entries for ice climbing versus a place like Colorado with TEN PAGES of entries it makes one wonder. . . It looks like nearby Hyalite Canyon has some great variety. Thanks for the guide book recommendation.

Having lived in both Montana and Colorado for some time. I would say the job market is much better in Colorado. I found alpine climbing to be a bit better in Montana, and the northwest. More remote/ less people, longer approaches. There are many ice routes in Glacier/ waterton park,/ montana in general, that don't always make it to mountain project, or any other sights. Montana's people are very independent,not wrapped up, in what the climbing community is doing. Plus an eight hour drive can get you up to canada. B/C is as good as it gets,for alpinists, selkerks/ bugaboos/ mt Robson, and on, and south you have the Tetons, and better yet the Wind rivers. Montana's down side is,LONG WINTERS, very limited quality, rock climbing. You could spend years rock climbing the colorado front range, and never climb it all. And for me , the main reason for living in colorado now, Is the weather is fantastic 300 sunny days a year. Ski in the morning, rock climb in the afternoon! Can't do the in montana.

Steve House decided on Colorado. read his last couple of blogs.

http://www.stevehouse.net/Site/Training ... olume.html

Excitable Boy, I readily admit my few "Climbing" days are far behind me but given the Glaciers there in WA do not compare with either Oregon or Wyoming and the relief can be far less dramatic than lots of stuff in my neck of the woods I'm curious how you arrived at that determination? The Winds aside when I went up the Grand over 30 years ago I certainly thought the Black Ice Culoir was genuine, steep, icy, mixed, etc? Mt. Moran blew me a lot farther away than anything up around Seattle. Just curious how you arrived at the opinion you have.

Jackson is now arguably the wealthiest town on the planet with all the Wall Street Refuges and Trustafarians. I would guess there is an IT job there or in Teton Valley, ID that could be dynamite for you. NOLS in Lander needs computer people I would guess. I have no idea about tech jobs in Cody but I'm sure you realize it is a SERIOUS Ice climbing area that rivals if not exceeds anything mentioned thus far in some kennings.

If I were in your shoes, I'd be thinking either the San Juans or Montana. Hyalite is supposed to be awesome, just not as well published as areas in the Front Range or San Juans. Cody has more burly ice than virtually all of CO, but it still seems to fall off most people's radars. Also think about what you'll be doing when the ice isn't there. Lots of good rock and mt. biking in the San Juans; Bozeman area too.

Edit: http://montanaice.com/

I'm sure that any of your potential destinations will be great. But I sure do love living in Grand Junction. I moved here on a whim four years ago and I've not regretted it. The variety of places that can be reached from here is incredibly diverse and relatively short in distance.

Rough drive times from Grand Junction:

2 hours to Ouray/start of San Juan Range
Just under 2 hours to Moab/Arches/Canyonlands National Park
0-15 minutes to Colorado National Monument
15-45 minutes to Unaweep Canyon (I think this place is highly underrated)
About an hour to Black Canyon of the Gunnison National Park
45 minutes to Grand Mesa
About 2 hours to Aspen/Elk/West Elk Ranges
About 2.5 hours to beginning of Gore/Sawatch Ranges

The list goes on and on....and those are destinations that skip everything in between, which is usually pretty awesome. There are drawbacks however, the community is predominated by older folks...not that this is bad....it just makes it less socially interesting for the younger crowd.