by fatdad » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:37 pm
by CSUMarmot » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:10 pm
alpine345 wrote:To address the OP's first question: Yes better climbers often forgo a rope on 4th class and 5.easy terrain for upward progress but less often for down. But it's not only the difficulty of the actual physical movement skills that is the limiting factor, but all the other issues that comprise the risk. Yeah, I know, I've seen guys in Tevas solo 5.10d up and down, but most people can't, and certainly not in the rain, at night, tired, with a pack, or hungry, etc, etc. "Bring a Rope" is shorthand for bring the tools and skills necessary to elevate the game to the next level if conditions dictate. A rope, harness, HMS biner, quicklink, and a hank(30') of runner is my minimum "bring a rope" kit; I often throw in my "small rack"(1.5 lbs) because it opens up a whole range of other possibilities. I contend that you need to have experience climbing at the mid to upper 5.x range before you have the judgement and skill to comfortably solo very much 5.easy terrain. A couple of moves of 5.7, then back to talus hopping is still 4th class.
by MoapaPk » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:09 am
by alpine345 » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:35 am
by seano » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:44 pm
alpine345 wrote:As if a "rock climber" would forgo the more basic protection techniques that you advocate for short pitches in favor of engineering solutions for those same pitches?
by The Chief » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:30 pm
alpine345 wrote: A "mountaineer's " goal is to get to the top, using any appropriate skill set(hiking, skiing, rock/ice climbing, etc). The route selection defines the rules of the game i.e. the skill set du jour. Your attitude is irrelevant except only whether you chose to accept the challenge, or not...... I can tell you that I use the most efficient techniques that I have to get to the top. But I'll tell you the first and last hip belay I caught a fall with, was 1972. If you ever catch one you'll never do it again, either. Just try it, you won't like it.
Dulfersitz rappel
by TheGeneral » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:56 pm
The Chief wrote:Dulfersitz rappel
Exercise this technique just once on an overhanging full free fall rap and I guarantee you will never do it again. That is if you are still alive and have retained your nutsack.
by The Chief » Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:21 pm
TheGeneral wrote:Bullhockey. You should hire a guide to teach you the proper technique, The Chief. The dulfersitz is a basic skill every mountaineer should be familiar with, along with the knowledge of how to tie a bowline on a coil.
by MoapaPk » Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:22 pm
alpine345 wrote:Are you attempting to imply that a person's attitude towards a given physical situation changes the reality of that situation? As if a "rock climber" would forgo the more basic protection techniques that you advocate for short pitches in favor of engineering solutions for those same pitches? That "just" a 30' section of 5.x won't splatter you if you're just "trying to get to the top", so you don't need to use competent technique? That canyoneers somehow understand something (physics?) that "rock climbers" don't?
The first sentence seems to confuse "rock climbers" versus "mountaineers". A "mountaineer's " goal is to get to the top, using any appropriate skill set(hiking, skiing, rock/ice climbing, etc). The route selection defines the rules of the game i.e. the skill set du jour. Your attitude is irrelevant except only whether you chose to accept the challenge, or not. Being a mountaineer, I can tell you that I use the most efficient techniques that I have to get to the top. But I'll tell you the first and last hip belay I caught a fall with, was 1972. If you ever catch one you'll never do it again, either. Just try it, you won't like it.
by lcarreau » Thu Feb 16, 2012 4:03 pm
by asmrz » Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:33 pm
by alpine345 » Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:54 pm
by mrchad9 » Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:58 pm
alpine345 wrote:I think we should go PM to un-clutter this thread
alpine345 wrote:Sharing and spreading information is one purpose of forums like this .
by asmrz » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:40 pm
by CSUMarmot » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:48 pm
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