ScottyP wrote:Follow-up: I was on Denali the last three weeks with the Spantiks and they were great. I did bring 40 below purple haze overboots for summit day, but did not need them. The weather was good, -20* was the lowest we saw. I am very happy with the Spantiks and several of the guides I saw as well as the NPS at 17 camp had them on and stated they loved them. Boots are a very debatable item and we all have our opinions. I just thought I would share my experience. (I did get some shin-bang on the one day descent from 17k to KIA! )

welcome back, Scott! how did it go?

I wore the spantiks on denali a couple of years ago and they worked great. I brought overboots but found them way to clunky to wear. They didn't work well with my crampons. I would consider a pair of super gators to go with the spantik' though.

Hmm, my purple haze were sweet! Did not notice they were on!

ScottyP wrote:Hmm, my purple haze were sweet! Did not notice they were on!

How did they work with your crampons? What type did you use? any idea on how they would work with step-in crampons?

Thanks a ton!

Used them with Grivel G-12 with no issues what-so-ever. They are a beast to put on, but I think that goes with the territory. One of the guides I saw had them perm. atached to his Spantiks on his third season with them. I also saw three of the climbing rangers at 17 wearing them as well.

Vitaliy M wrote:SO SCARPA INVERNO..OVER BOOTS OR WITHOUT?

Scarpa Invernos with stock liners you will probably want overboots. I wore Invernos with Intuition heat molded liners and insulated super gaitors and my feet were fine and it was a particularly cold year.

As far as weight goes Spantiks weigh 5 lbs 1 oz, Invernos 5 lbs 13 oz (US 8/EU 40). Swapping the stock liners for Intuitions will drop the Inverno's weight to 4 lbs, 15 oz. The Intuition liners are also significantly warmer than the stock liners. So, for $150.00 you get a lighter and warmer boot and if the Inverno has seen significant use the stock liner is probably packed out and not as warm as it used to be anyway.

As far as insulated supergaitors vs overboots, the only advantage supergaitors have over overboots is they are less bulky. 40 Below K2 overboots are as light or even lighter than many insulated supergaitors and are significantly warmer. Most supergaitors have a large rubber rand so the insulation only extends to the top of the boot whereas overboots wrap the entire boot in insulation. Likely the warmest and also one of the lightest supergaitors is the Outdoor Research X-gaitor. The insulation extends all the way to the boot's welt, but they are also the bulkiest insulated supergaitor.

Another important thing to keep in mind is that even the warmest boots aren't magic. If you don't take proper care to dry your socks out and stay hydrated and fed you can still end up with problems. Colin Haley got frostbite in Spantiks on Foraker largely due to his socks getting wet and dehydration.

Yup, you can take them to get fitted. Although, make absolutely sure that you go to a reputable shop that routinely fits Intuitions. It's a simple process, but very, very easy to screw up. Look for stores that guarantee their boot fitting.

If nothing else, make sure they use a toe cap - if they don't, walk right out of the store.

Vitaliy M wrote:If you know a good place to get Intuition liners let me know. After they arrive I take the boots/liners to a place where they could bake and fit me right? (I never got anything fitted before, this is all new to me)

Yes, you will need to buy the liners and have them baked and fitted. I bought mine and had them fitted at Marmot Mountain Works, I think there is one in California? Ski shops can also bake and fit liners, but Intuition liners for ski boots are different than the ones made for mountaineering boots. When you go in for your fitting wear the sock combination you will wear with the boots. For me that was a thin liner sock, a VBL and a thick wool mountaineering sock. They should give you a neoprene toe cap - put this between your liner and outer sock to keep it in place. Also, you will bring a good pair of insoles for the baking and fitting process. Intuition does not supply them. Make sure they are very supportive (i.e. stiff) and if you can find some with some insulation like cork on the bottom all the better. I used Superfeet although I am sure there are other brands that would work as well.

Make a run to Shasta and have JACQUE (Fifth Season) fit them. I took mine up there and had him add a custom footbed. Afterwards, I hiked to Helen (in December) and came back in for more adjustments that afternoon. All told, in and out for $35.00 including a custom "garage" built into the boot for a bone spur!

Vitaliy M wrote:
Great info EB, thank you. If you know a good place to get Intuition liners let me know. After they arrive I take the boots/liners to a place where they could bake and fit me right? (I never got anything fitted before, this is all new to me)

If you need size 9 or 10 I can set you up with a pair that were used once (1 day), for half of what they are new. Can be done in the oven at home, with care, but probably better to take them somewhere if you've never seen it done. Good advice from EB. You got partners for next year already?

Vitaliy M wrote:. Spantiks are rated for 7000M peaks by la sportiva. I don't get this rating for height of a peak, shouldn't it be rated for temperature, kind of like sleeping bag.

Pretty much all 7,000 meter peaks occur between specific latitudes so the temperatures you may encounter are fairly consistent. According to Wikipedia "all 7,000 m (23,000 ft) peaks in the world are located in the centre of Asia (East Asia, Central Asia and South Asia) in a rectangle edged by Noshaq (7,492 m (24,580 ft)) on the Afghanistan-Pakistan border in the West, Peak Jengish Chokusu, (Tuōmù'ěr Fēng) (7,439 m (24,406 ft)) on the Kyrgyzstan - Xinjiang border to the North, Gongga Shan (Minya Konka) (7,556 m (24,790 ft)) in Sichuan to the East, and Kabru (7,412 m (24,318 ft)) on the Sikkim - Nepal border to the South." There are no 7,000 meter peaks in the polar regions. So it is a round about way of declaring temperature ratings without declaring temperature ratings.

benjamingray wrote:

Vitaliy M wrote:
Good advice from EB. You got partners for next year already?

No. The rising cost of climbing in Alaska has forced me to look elsewhere. Any interest in Bolivia?

I would certainly wear my Invernos with Intuition liners and insulated supergaitors during the 'normal' climbing season on 7,000 meter peaks. I think the bigger difference between Spantiks and Invernos with Intuition liners is how precise they climb. Invernos, while durable, warm boots are boxy and don't climb technical ground as well as many of the newer boots on the market. IMHO, once you put crampons on there is not much difference in climbing ability between boots.

Yeah, Fifth Season boots are pricey. I got my Spantiks online for around $275 and paid him a little bit to make them perfect for me. But, he is VERY good at his job!